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EXCERPTS FROM KAIWISDOM & FIGHTINGFANTASY LISTS: Welcome to the kaiwisdom mailing list! Please save this message for future reference. Thank you. If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, send the following command in email to : unsubscribe Or you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe kaiwisdom or from another account, besides ttaylor@tps.vic.edu.au: unsubscribe kaiwisdom ttaylor@tps.vic.edu.au If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. [Last updated on: Sun Apr 19 14:41:57 EDT 1998] Welcome to Kaiwisdom, the online mailing list about Lone Wolf and Magnamund. This list is maintained by Julian Egelstaff, lonewolf@freenet.carleton.ca, and Christopher M. Dingle, cmd@world.std.com. You can send messages to the list by mailing to: kaiwisdom@world.std.com You can unsubscribe from the list by sending the word "unsubscribe", without the quotes, to: kaiwisdom-request@world.std.com Kaiwisdom is a fairly high-traffic list, with several dozen members. In order to make the discussion managable, and keep the "signal to noise ratio" high, the members ask that everyone keep the following general guidelines in mind: I) Messages addressed to kaiwisdom@world.std.com are meant to be of general interest to the members of the list, and as such should be related in an obvious way to Lone Wolf, Magnamund or Joe Dever. II) Messages which are intended for or directed to an individual or individuals should be addressed to that/those individual or individuals and not to the entire list. III) Messages which are obscene, insulting, derogatory or hurtful will not be tolerated by the list members. Anyone posting such messages will be warned once by the list owner that their message contravenes the intentions of Kaiwisdom. Any subsequent message of the same type will result in the offending individual being unsubscribed from the list. IV) If anyone finds a particular thread to be straying too far from the intended topic area of Kaiwisdom they are encouraged to e-mail the list owner explaining their frustrations. At the list owner's discretion, given a non-negligible number of messages regarding a particular thread, the list owner may ask that such a thread be discontinued or carried on via private e-mail. V) The application of these house rules is the sole responsibility of the list owner. List members are asked to direct their concerns to the list owner rather than to the list as a whole. VI) These house rules are agreed upon by a majority of the members of Kaiwisdom and may be amended, expanded and/or discarded at anytime so long as a majority of the list members agree to the amendment, expansion and/or alteration. We welcome you, the newest member of Kaiwisdom. May Ishir and Kai protect you on your journeys. Robert Hastings wrote: > Hey, somebody remembers! I'll have to repost it, or toss it into my Web > account. If I can find it, that is. I remember. I saved it actually. Here it is: ------------------------------------ Upon becoming the first Kai Supreme Master, Lone Wolf believed his quest for physical and spiritual perfection to be finished. However, just as had happened when he ascended to Grand Mastership, he discovered that his training was still incomplete. Sure, Lone Wolf may have become the most powerful mortal in all of Aon, but why stop there? Through his continued seclusion in the Vault of the Sun, Lone Wolf's first gift from the God Kai was the skill of Kai Weaponcraft, which he used to bestow the new crop of Grand Masters with it's own set of super-cool weapons. But the Supreme Master was soon to begin his study of new Disciplines, through whose mastery he would ultimately attain the rank of... Well, let's face it; there is apparently no limit to Lone Wolf's potential; he can only strive toward total absurdity. And he does so through his training in the Super Deluxe Grand Magnakai Disciplines (often referred to simply as the Supreme Master Disciplines). SUPREME WEAPONMASTERY --------------------- As it pertains to the use of conventional weapons, this Discipline is actually rather useless, as a Supreme Master can kill any sentient being with his bare hands. Supreme Weaponmastery allows its user to wield everyday objects with the same skill and deadliness as a sword or dagger. Lone Wolf can enter any battle with confidence, wielding only a spoon, a rocking chair, or the like. However, not even a Supreme Master can harness the mysteries of the common razor blade; shaving is just as difficult for Lone Wolf as it is for the next guy. When entering combat, a Supreme Master armed with any object may add 20 points to his COMBAT SKILL. If unarmed, he may only add 19. SUPREME HUNTMASTERY ------------------- Again, this Discipline is largely useless, as Supreme Masters no longer require sustanance. But it's mastery still greatly heightens Lone Wolf's senses, allowing him to see, hear, and smell through any solid barrier. NONEXISTENCE ------------ The advanced form of Assimilance (and the really advanced form of Invisibility, and the really really advanced form of Camouflage) gives a Supreme Master the ability to remove himself from reality at will. Improvement in this Discipline allows one to remove himself completely from history, leaving behind a universe in which he never existed. This is especially conducive to practical jokes. ANIMAL DOMINANCE ---------------- A Supreme Master with this Discipline can exert his will upon any living creature, and can expect absolute obediance, to a point. Not even a Supreme Master can prevent even the most loyal of dogs from dragging its butt across the carpet. INTUITION --------- The ultimate form of Sixth Sense, Intuition permits a Supreme Master to psychically "tune in" to any location, and any time, in his present plane of existence, offering him a virtual front-row seat at all of the comings and goings in the universe. Upon mastery of this Discipline, a Supreme Master acquires an understaning of the opposite sex. SUPREME PATHSMANSHIP -------------------- A Supreme Master who has diligently practiced this Discipline realizes that sometimes, you simply have to stop and ask for directions. This in no way diminishes his manhood, and, in the long run, makes him look like less of an idiot on those long pilgrimages. (Naturally, female Supreme Masters have no need of this ability.) MAGNAKAI-SURGE -------------- The ultimate in psychic attacks, Magnakai-Surge enables its wielder to vaporize an opponent with a single nasty thought. This discipline illistrates the value of self-esteem, and why it is instilled so early in Kai training; even the slightest negative thought about oneself could be suicidal. MAGNAKAI-SCREEN --------------- This Discipline is a favorite among Supreme Masters, as it enables its user to "tune out" of any boring, or otherwise useless, conversation. It is especially useful at diplomatic functions, and when arguing with a significant other (on those rare occasions when a Supreme Master actually has a love life). Successful mastery of Magnakai-Screen and Intuition enable a Supreme Master to withstand any relationship. PURIFICATION ------------ The ultimate form of Healing, Purification provides a Supreme Master with rapid recovery from any injuries, whether sustained in combat or by dumb luck. As such, scholars of Kai wisdom need not argue about its applicability. Only paper cuts are immune to this healing process. Purification can also be used to cure any disease, remove any affliction, or neutralize any toxin, within himself or another. Of course, not even Purification can cure the common cold, but, having learned Herbmastery, one already has a great recipe for chicken soup. SUPREME NEXUS ------------- The Discipline of Supreme Nexus grants to its user virtual invulnerability to the elements. A Supreme Master who uses this Discipline can freely run naked through Kalte, or go for a dip inside an active volcano, without fear of ill effects. Of course, not even a Supreme Master can be protected from the cold marble floors of the Kai Monastery. LEVELS OF SUPREME MASTERY ------------------------- We all know that the concept of rank became pretty much useless after a Kai lord reached the rand of Grand Master (at least initially). Perhaps Lone Wolf just wanted something cool to put on his stationery. So, of course, he has adopted ranks for mastery of the Super Deluxe Grand Magnakai Disciplines. Number of Disciplines Rank ----------- ---- 1 Kai Supreme Master 2 Kai Supreme Master Senior 3 Kai Supreme Master Superior 4 Kai Supreme Defender 5 Any of this sound familiar? 6 Sun King 7 Kai Novice (sort of a second childhood, I guess) 8 All right! We get the point! 9 Kai Supreme Egotist 10 You know what? Screw Kai! I'm in charge now! On Monday, 24 august Tristan Taylor wrote: >Can someone please fill me in as to why Gary Chalk ceased to >draw the illustrations in Lone Wolf Books after #8 (The Jungle >of Horrors) Joe Dever and Gary Chalk fell out after LW8, I think. Gary has since moved to New Zealand, and they have lost contact. You can find more information in the Joe Dever interview at the Kai Monastery(www.ncf.carleton.ca/~as300/). Those "Ninja" books were called the Way of the Tiger series. There were six of them, all published in 1988-1989. Without a doubt, they were second only to the Lone Wolf series in quality. (Yes, I think they were better than the Grey Star series). The series ends rather unhappily after book six. The final text there actually states "The End" after the reader finds his hero in a near hopeless situation. I held out hope for a few years that the series would be resumed, but it obviously never was. It is set in the same world as an old Fighting Fantasy game book from the early 1980's called the Talisman of Death. Damn, I miss the gamebook craze of the 1980's. I would still read any of those that I could find... >My apologies if this has been discussed >previously on this list, before my joining. Do >most of you guys out there consider the Silver >Bow of Duadon a weapon, or a special item? >When you first get it, the book says it's a >weapon, but in latter books, sometimes, when it >asks you if you have it, it will refer to it as a >special item. If it is a weapon, there are a lot >more opportunities for it to be lost, broken, etc., >than there would if it were a special item. To >me, it makes more sense to have it be a special >item, like other special weapons are. (e.g. the >Sommerswerd, Dagger of Vashna, Helshezag, >etc.) But since it does say, when you first get it, >that it is just a regular weapon, I don't know. >-Jumping Frog >Yeah, the only place i can remember in can be >broken is by that prick in the weapons shop in >Tharro, Talestria (LW #8). By the way, do you >get a +3 combat skill bonus for the bow, and a >+3 combat skill bonus for weaponmastery when >using a bow (total +6), or just a +3 cs bonus. >The rules in book #6 are a bit unclear on this >subject. Comments? >Black Death >(aka Tristan Taylor) Useually when you fire yur bow, you pick a number on the Random Number Table(or you roll a dice.) and turn the section depending on your number. With the Silver Bow or Weaponsmastery in bows, you add three to the number you pick. I beliveve that's how it works. >Well, > >It has been a while since the last rounds of pronunciations took >place...(six months or so) so here is another list which may or may >not contain some of the ones previously discussed... > >1. Shpydar >2. Brumalmarc Kzu'tooa >3. Avarvae >4. Sommerswerd >5. Elzian >6. Qinefer >7. Kraan >8. Lohn >9. Lone Wolf (Just kiddin'...) >10. Duadon > >My pronunciations are as follows: > >1. ShPY-der >2. BRU-mul-mark kzoo-TOE-uh >3. uh-VAR-vay >4. SOM-mer-swerd >5. EL-zi-an >6. KIH-neh-fur >7. CRAN (berry juice.) =) >8. LONE >9. LONE WULF >10. DOO-uh-dawn > I think the beauty of written literature is that you can interpret the words as you wish. It also makes correspondance by typing a lot easier too! In case you are wondering, here is my interpretation of the pronuounciation 1. Shpider (like spider with a 'h') 2. Broo-mool-mark zoo tour (k is silent) 3. a-var-vay 4. sommer-serd (like sword, a silent w) 5. Elzian (that's how I would pronounce it!) 6. Kwin-e-fir (sort of like qu in queen) 7. Krarn 8. Lonn (emphasis on n) 9. Lown Woolf! 10. Dew-a-don thanks Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) I mostly agree with Black Death except > 6. Kwin-e-fir (sort of like qu in queen) Notice that it's spelled Qinefer not Q_u_inefer. I pronounce it kin-e-fir. > 7. Krarn Where'd the extra 'r' come from? :) kran. Jonathan Blake To justify my reasoning, I say kwin-e-fir because I come from Australia. In Australia, qe have a lot of acronyms involving the letter 'Q'. You may have heard of the airline QANTAS for example. It's pronounced Kwantas. (It stands for Queensland and Northern Territory Air Service). I put the extra 'r' in my pronounciation of Kraan, as the Dutch often use the double 'a' to emphasise an 'arr' sound. Like advocaat - the drink - (pronounced advo-cart) > >I'm not suggesting that my reasoning is correct, I just thought that i'd clarify my position to this matter. Sorry I didn't make myself clear in the first instance, and thanks for your time. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) If we're going into other languages, though, I think it's only fair to mention that in Norwegian, 'aa' is pronounced, roughly, as a long O, so you could make the argument for Kroan and Gnoag as pronunciations of Kraan and Gnaag, but I think that would sound funny. Ben Similarly, the name Haakon (is the "o" right? I can't remember how it is spelled exactly) is the name of real Norwegian kings and is apparently pronounced "ho-ken": I was very disappointed to find that out, as I greatly prefer my self-made pronunciation of "Hay-uh-kon". Since I found that out, though, I've been assuming that Joe Dever intended the long "o" pronunciation, and picked the name of Norwegian kings for the Darklord in Shadow on the Sand. By extrapolation, I guess I think Gnohg and Krohn probably are officially correct, although I'll keep using Nag and Kran myself. And I'll keep using Krarn, Gnarg, and Harkon! As I stated in my initial letter is that the beauty of the written language is that is to be interpreted by each and every individual who reads it. It is good that we can have a discussion such as this and colloborate our various ideas on the pronounciation. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) You're missing the point here. Yes, Red Fox did discontinue Wolf's Bane, Buccaneers, etc, but you have to acknowledge the fact that Lone Wolf was getting unprofitable and both publishers felt it best to discontinue the series. As it happens, when a publisher discontinues a bookline, it's not going to give anything about the remaining books and the quality of printing. The reason why Berkely abridged the Grand Master was because it stopped selling enough to justify giving Lone Wolf full treatment and so chose to assign sloppy copyeditors, lowered production standards, and excess pricing. Publishers don't care about the books they print unless they can make a profit. The publisher that does is a rare gem and unfortunately for any author seeking out a publisher like that is a gamble because they are one in a dozen. Capitalism is cutthroat. And, I personally don't find the US versions too bad. I think we here on the list are slightly glorifying UK Grandmasters and seeing what we have in the States as bad (something similar has been going on with the Magnamund Companion, which is really not as good a book as it has been made out to be). I've read both sides of Grandmaster books, and the main problems with the US ones are that there are often poor copyediting mistakes but otherwise the books are still enjoyable (except for CAPTIVES OF KAAG, to me a wretched book anyway you put it, and even more so when I am confronted by its unpleasant memories while reading its poor rehash TRAIL OF THE WOLF). Joe Dever's writing should be strong enough in theory to survive abridgement, and the abridgement in the States version simply cuts off the amount of choices one has, not the storyline in general. I believe (though haven't read the books for months) that the US one is easier because you don't have to fight Zantaz, who is quite a stinger. And Wolf's Bane was still fun to read in the US version. They didn't cut some of the good parts from it (though it might have been interesting if they hacked out Alyss! One regret I have with Berkley-if they had excised her from all the books then we wouldn't have to deal with such a weakened as contrasted with the Legends character in the gamebooks) The thing is, I believe Berkley to have been an excellent publisher for Lone Wolf (HORRIBLE customer service phone line, though! If it's still anything like the one in 1993, DON'T press 4 when they give you the list of choices, and I'm positive they hang up on you if you have a rotary phone-not that I would know or anything :-), at least in the early days. It did market Lone Wolf, made sure there were ample supplies on the market (hard to believe nowadays but even when I started Lone Wolf one could buy a copy of every book except for the Magnamund Companion, which I hear had a low print run) but unfortunately had to be pragmatic. A book is killed off when it doesn't sell. In the case of the Grey Star and Legends series, those books, even by the admission of their authors, did not sell very well. I suspect (but have no proof) that part of Joe Dever's attitude towards Grey Star is because the series was pretty much a bust (I'm quite certain it had an exceedingly short life, in book terms), but of course he can dislike the character if he so chooses. And of course, John Grant's lack of interest in the Legends is partly because that series, even if it did result in 14 books and audiotapes in the UK and 5 books in the US also failed. My point is that publishers have to cut losses and make profits. Buccaneers wasn't reprinted I suspect because the decision to kill Lone Wolf was made by then (and if the series is going to gone, reprinting Buccaneers would be absolutely idiotic). In Shangri-la we would be able to read any book we wanted, and have these books to pass on to posterity. But in the real world, the publisher that holds sentiment is often killed off, especially if it does so repeatedly. I've befriended many authors and they agree: regardless of the cost to the reader, the publisher's goal in life is to make money. Whatever the cost. Which is very, very regrettable. Good thoughts, guys-I wouldn't mind hearing more. -Jeff I have read the recent "We Hate Publishers" messages with great interest. Here is my theory: The market for GAMEbooks has shrunk tremendously because the market for PC videoGAMES has increased tremendously. This has forced publishers of a genre that doesn't sell as well anymore to do drastic things. The average age of people on this list is approximately 19 from a previous study. When LW first came out, few people our age had PC's, and even then, the best things out there were Apple IIe and IBM's with minimal capabilities (compared to today). Even then, the quality of video games back then wasn't all that great, even though it was a new territory for adventure gaming. You could do glorified text adventures on a blue screen (ZORK, anyone?) or slightly better with a picture of your enemy making a generic wave of his sword. How many people our age REALLY liked to read...to immerse ourselves in what an author has thoughtfully written? We were an exception to the rule. Today, home PC's are much much more common. PC Video games, which used have their limits dictated by the standards of the day, now drive the PC market to have better and higher capabilities. Young people who REALLY enjoy reading books today (and who are willing to hunt down/buy books) are probably even more rare than before. (Not to rip on people younger than myself, I'm pretty sure it is a fact that PC games are more popular than reading among ALL age groups nowadays.) Computer games have dried up the market for gamebooks. The instant gratification of slicing off your opponent's limb and watching all of the high detail gory graphics has replaced reading about it and trying to visualize it. The decisions we loved to make in gamebooks are what people come to expect in video games. But, things in life often come in cycles. Perhaps innovation like Steve Jackson's Deathtrap Dungeon, which has been converted to a PC video game, will spark a new interest in gamebooks. Magnamund games would have to be more ground breaking though. Joe Dever has gotten too many "Gamebook of the Year" awards to not make waves with a Magnaund-based PC adventure. Ever play Jedi Knight? The addition of Force powers to an engine similar to Quake has earned it many "Game of the Year" awards for taking the game in a totally different dimention. I still can't get over how much "Force Pull" reminds me of Mind Over Matter. Maybe adding a "Flight From the Dark" in with the package would help encourage people to see what else is out there. My unsolicited opinions, Jason Red Hunter in the LW ERPG If you think about it, it makes sense. When Red Fox took over publishing, there had already been several editions published of LW #1, therefore every established reader of Lone Wolf would have no doubt bought a copy, and would not need to buy another copy. There is only one reproduction of The Buccaneers of Shadaki, and every established LW follower, plus the new converts obviously want to get hold of it. It's a simple case of twice the demand, but one supply. Tristan Taylor (aka Black Death) >If I recall correctly, the jewelled mace aided Lone Wolf in at least one >combat. He had to fight a serpent or an ugly monster, receiving >extra CS points when he had the item. However, that did not occur until a >later book than 5. Other than that, give me the Sommerswerd anyday. That's right, I think I remember now. Wasn't it called a Dhorgaan? I know you can get Jewelled Maces all over the place, in the case with the Yas in it, in the vaxeler's cave... Jason Last night I finished dismantling the Grey Star series. First, i have some questions that I would like your input on: 1. In book 1, when you go to find Jnana, and you attack the Najin, it gives the combat stats for all 9 Najin, but the maximum number you could fight is five, because it says to stop combat after five rounds. That means the combat stats for Najins 6-9 are irrelevant. 2. Does anyone else's copy of book 3 have a large black spot covering much of the second paragraph of section 213, the one where you try to disenchant Tanith of the spell she is under that makes her think you're the Jahksa? I have also found two sections where you are misdirected. 1. In book 1, section 266, you are given a choice to evade or combat the Quoku diving at you. If you choose to evade, you are sent to section 333, which should be 330. 2. In book 4, section 280, where you have to destroy a bridge with the power of your staff (and expend 9 Willpower in the process), you are sent to section 175, but instead it should be 59. And finally, my versions of the pronunciations. Shasarak - SHAZ-uh-rack Suhn - SOON Acarya - uh-KAR-ya Kazim - KAH-zim Najin - na-YIN Jnana - y-NA-na Shadaki - SHAH-da-key ezeran - EZ-er-an alether - AL-uh-THer (hard TH) Quoku - KWOK-oo Azakawa - uh-ZAH-ka-wa Kleasa - klee-uh-SA Tarama - TAR-um-ah Shianti - shee-AHN-tee calacena - cal-uh-SEEN-ah Urik - YOR-ik (Like Robert Urich) Samu - sa-MOO Hugi - HOO-jee Karnali - KARN-uh-lee Sado - SAH-doe Gyanima - jy-AN-im-a Masbati - mahs-ba-TAY Agarash - I used to think AG-a-rash but since the author is British I'd have to say it's ah-GAR-ish And now that I mention Tarama seeds, which conveniently take up no space in your Herb Pouch, can you use them in combat? Wouldn't it be nifty if you could munch a seed, then use a 30 or 40 point blast from your Staff to take out Shasarak or the Demon Master without expending any Willpower? And what happens if you run out of Willpower? In book 1, which is extremely difficult considering that you have to fight several enemies that are much stronger than you, including that blasted 25/30 Kleasa that grubs on your soul for four rounds of combat. It is so easy to just get destroyed by that thing. But what if you have no willpower left at all and you are at an impasse where it is necessary to cast some type of spell? I always keep some Laumspur handy for that priest in the Tower of Truth so that I get the 10-point bonus, but still, overuse of Prophecy can seriously deplete your Willpower, especially considering your multiple bouts with Mother Magri, the Kleasa, the Mantiz, Deathgaunts, Shadakine, and Shasarak himself. In book 4, you start out with a set score of 50 Willpower and 30 Endurance. It says in both cases that if you have read any previous GS books to add your previous totals to the ones bestowed upon you by the Moonstone. Adding +50 to your Willpower is fine since it can go as high as it wants, but can it be possible to have up to 59 endurance, or are we supposed to just assume that the Moonstone just replenishes GS to a full 30/30? And the only time that you can ever increase GS's CS that I know of is to use the Jewelled Dagger (+1 CS - big deal) or to find some Phinomel in book 4, which can give you up to a hearty +9 CS. But not finding them could in fact lead to a combat ratio of as low as -20 when fighting Shasarak, if you can even survive through all four books with only a CS of 10. Well, now that my fingers are sore, I suppose I'm done now. Jason Okay, I thought I'd throw my thoughts in regarding the Healing / Curing / Deliverance mess. A strict reading of Healing is that it can only heal EP lost in combat. Thus, it can't restore EP lost to starvation, mental attacks, falls, etc. Now, this is a bit unrealistic, because sometimes LW loses EP out- side of combat but still via a weapon; e.g., he gets shot with an arrow or cut by a trap. There's no way Healing would "know" to distinguish these types of wounds. The other bad thing about the strict reading is that it requires you to keep track not only of how much EP you've lost but what type of loss it was. This means a lot of paperwork. Curing can restore more than just combat damage. So again, you have the paperwork problem. But Curing also gives LW immunity to some poisons (esp. in Castle Death it gets used that way a lot), etc. When shifting from Kai series to Magnakai series, I think LW should retain "basic Healing" until he *replaces* it with Curing. Thus he can always restore points lost to combat damage throughout the Magnakai series. This does tend to make some of the books too easy, but *not* having Healing makes them too hard. Of course you could always take Curing as one of your initial disciplines, but hardly anyone ever does that -- at least no one I know. (?) Deliverance should, be extension, let LW heal *any* type of damage. No more paperwork problems. Plus it has various text-related benefits. Okay, what does anyone have to say about this? Joshua 'Enjolras' Randall Jason Valasek wrote: > I have found no purpose in keeping the Jewelled Mace. The Jewelled Mace has a few uses in the books I will list them. Minor Spoilers below. Also in sections were it says "If the weapon you are using is a special item add x to the number picked" it may be useful Book 5: In the tomb of the majaan you get a +5 CS bonus against that creauure Haakon summons. Book 8: You can exchange it for a grey crystal ring in Tharro Book 14: You can use it against the Helghast in Kaag That is about it I think and if you got the Sommerswerd (and how hasnt) then you dont need it. My name is Tristan Taylor, I'm 17 years old and I'm a student in Melbourne, Australia. I am relatively new to the Lone Wolf world, as I have been a reader since 1994. I have been reading gamebooks since 1989, but for some reason, Lone Wolf never appealed to me in my early days. I really enjoyed Steve Jackson's and Ian Livingstone's Fighting Fantasy series. As the supply of new stories died up for FF around 1993-94, and I had the whole series, I decided to move on to Lone Wolf. In 1990, my grandmother gave me a copy of The Magnamund Companion. I enjoyed the book and the world of Magnamund, but I guess I saw Lone WOlf as a threat to Fighting Fantasy. Anyway, as I moved on to reading Lone Wolf, it didn't take me long to get the whole series. The first Lone Wolf book I bought was #15, the Darke Crusade, and the last one (discluding Vampirium) was #6, the Kingdoms of Terror. This books was the only one I had trouble obtaining. I (in all seriousness) went all over Australia searching for this book, and eventually, I turned to the internet to find an international company to obtain this book from. Eventually I found kaiwisdom, and I was guided towards Senator Publications, who greatly assissted my quest to obtain this book. I have always looked forward to the release of the latest Lone Wolf book approx. every 6-9 months. Unfortunately, that has all but come to an end. The only qualm I have had about the books in the recent years, is the removal of the colour maps (after LW #24) and the increase in price here in Australia (from $8.95 to $9.95). I wouldn't have minded paying the extra price if the colour maps were retained. As for my Kai name (Black Death), this comes from the Giak name for me (Hel-taag) Black Killer. My fury and utter relentlessness in battle earned me this title from the dark minions of Naar, and thus has karried through to my Kai name. My name before was something stupid like Weak Rabbit!!!! I must go now. You can forward this letter to the other members of the commitee if you so wish. I look forward to making contributions, as well as receiving the wisdom of the Kai. Thanks, Black Death (Tristan Taylor) I'll trade you greystar series for some missing LW ones in my collection if you want -----Original Message----- From: Tristan Taylor [mailto:ttaylor@tps.vic.edu.au] Sent: Monday, 7 September 1998 15:23 To: Jason Valasek Cc: kaiwisdom@world.std.com Subject: Re: [LW] The Grey Star series In regards to the the pronounciations, I agree with most of them except I say: alether = Al-ee-ther (long e) shianti = Shy-an-tie (I pronounce the i's as y's or ie's) Not that it matters. Refer to my earlier messages for explanations. I would like to express my feelings on the Grey Star series, but in Australia (where we appear to have abundances of the Buccaneers of Shianti), there is a severe shortage of the series, and I only have book one. Black Death. At 10:02 AM 3/09/98 PDT, you wrote: >Last night I finished dismantling the Grey Star series. First, i have >some questions that I would like your input on: >1. In book 1, when you go to find Jnana, and you attack the Najin, it >gives the combat stats for all 9 Najin, but the maximum number you could >fight is five, because it says to stop combat after five rounds. That >means the combat stats for Najins 6-9 are irrelevant. >2. Does anyone else's copy of book 3 have a large black spot covering >much of the second paragraph of section 213, the one where you try to >disenchant Tanith of the spell she is under that makes her think you're >the Jahksa? > >I have also found two sections where you are misdirected. >1. In book 1, section 266, you are given a choice to evade or combat the >Quoku diving at you. If you choose to evade, you are sent to section >333, which should be 330. >2. In book 4, section 280, where you have to destroy a bridge with the >power of your staff (and expend 9 Willpower in the process), you are >sent to section 175, but instead it should be 59. > >And finally, my versions of the pronunciations. >Shasarak - SHAZ-uh-rack >Suhn - SOON >Acarya - uh-KAR-ya >Kazim - KAH-zim >Najin - na-YIN >Jnana - y-NA-na >Shadaki - SHAH-da-key >ezeran - EZ-er-an >alether - AL-uh-THer (hard TH) >Quoku - KWOK-oo >Azakawa - uh-ZAH-ka-wa >Kleasa - klee-uh-SA >Tarama - TAR-um-ah >Shianti - shee-AHN-tee >calacena - cal-uh-SEEN-ah >Urik - YOR-ik (Like Robert Urich) >Samu - sa-MOO >Hugi - HOO-jee >Karnali - KARN-uh-lee >Sado - SAH-doe >Gyanima - jy-AN-im-a >Masbati - mahs-ba-TAY >Agarash - I used to think AG-a-rash but since the author is British I'd >have to say it's ah-GAR-ish > >And now that I mention Tarama seeds, which conveniently take up no space >in your Herb Pouch, can you use them in combat? Wouldn't it be nifty if >you could munch a seed, then use a 30 or 40 point blast from your Staff >to take out Shasarak or the Demon Master without expending any >Willpower? >And what happens if you run out of Willpower? In book 1, which is >extremely difficult considering that you have to fight several enemies >that are much stronger than you, including that blasted 25/30 Kleasa >that grubs on your soul for four rounds of combat. It is so easy to >just get destroyed by that thing. But what if you have no willpower >left at all and you are at an impasse where it is necessary to cast some >type of spell? I always keep some Laumspur handy for that priest in the >Tower of Truth so that I get the 10-point bonus, but still, overuse of >Prophecy can seriously deplete your Willpower, especially considering >your multiple bouts with Mother Magri, the Kleasa, the Mantiz, >Deathgaunts, Shadakine, and Shasarak himself. >In book 4, you start out with a set score of 50 Willpower and 30 >Endurance. It says in both cases that if you have read any previous GS >books to add your previous totals to the ones bestowed upon you by the >Moonstone. Adding +50 to your Willpower is fine since it can go as high >as it wants, but can it be possible to have up to 59 endurance, or are >we supposed to just assume that the Moonstone just replenishes GS to a >full 30/30? And the only time that you can ever increase GS's CS that I >know of is to use the Jewelled Dagger (+1 CS - big deal) or to find some >Phinomel in book 4, which can give you up to a hearty +9 CS. But not >finding them could in fact lead to a combat ratio of as low as -20 when >fighting Shasarak, if you can even survive through all four books with >only a CS of 10. >Well, now that my fingers are sore, I suppose I'm done now. Jason >Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't some of the acoylytes Lone Wolf rounds >up to be the New Order of the Kai female? I'm pretty sure Lone Wolf >recognised Kai qualities in Qinefer, and wanted to round her up to. > >Black Death I've been remiss in reading Kaiwisdom, but I believe you're correct. In CLAWS OF HELGEDAD, Slutar's little war party ravages the Kai monastery searching for Qinefer (and in doing so kills off a latent Kai). Apparently, one of the survivors is a young girl, and she indirectly causes history to change through Carag. I think there are references to female Kai in ECLIPSE. Several times. One very gruesome, if I recall correctly, and another one preceding that. -Jeff (BOOK NO.) ENEMY: CS/EP (1) Giak: 9/9 (2) Wounded Helghast: 22/20 Giak 1: 13/10 Zombie Captain: 15/15 Giak 2: 12/10 Helghast: 22/30 Giaks: 15/13 Giaks: 16/14 Kraan: 16/24 Villager 1: 10/16 Vordak: 17/25 Szall 1: 6/9 Winged Serpent: 16/18 Villager 2: 11/14 Crypt Spawn: 16/16 Szall 2: 5/8 Burrowcrawler: 17/10 Villager 3: 11/17 Marsh Viper: 16/6 Watchtower Guard: 15/22 Drakkar: 15/23 Street Thief Leader: 15/23 Robber: 13/20 Trickster: 17/25 Doomwolf 1: 13/24 Knight of the White Mountain: 20/27 Doomwolf 2: 14/23 Harbour Thugs: 16/25 Doomwolf 3: 14/22 Town Guard Sergeant: 13/22 Doomwolf 4: 15/21 Halvorc: 8/11 Bodyguard: 11/21 Priest: 16/23 Black Bear: 16/10 Ganon/Dorier: 28/30 Gourgaz: 20/30 Viveka: 24/27 (3) Doomwolf 1: 15/24 (4) Guard 1: 18/23 Doomwolf 2: 14/23 Guard 2: 15/24 Doomwolf 3: 14/20 Guard 3: 15/21 Kalkoth 1: 11/35 Guard 4: 16/25 Kalkoth 2: 10/32 Guard 5: 14/24 Kalkoth 3: 8/30 Guard 6: 14/22 Helghast: 22/30 Bandit Warrior: 17/27 Ice Barbarian: 17/29 Bandit Leader: 19/29 Ice Barbarian: 15/14 Bandit Horseman: 17/24 Ice Barbarian Scout: 20/28 Giant Meresquid: 16/37 Ice Barbarian Mutants: 18/24 Tunnel Fiend: 20/10 Baknar: 19/30 Stoneworm: 15/38 Javek: 15/15 Vassagonian Warrior: 18/25 Crystal Frostwyrm: 15/30 Vassagonian Warhound: 17/25 Ice Barbarian + Doomwolf: 30/30 Vassagonian Captain: 22/28 Akraa'Neonor: 23/50 Drunken Guard: 13/29 Elix: 17/30 Barraka: 25/29 (5) Elix: 17/32 Bloodlug: 17/11 Kwaraz: 20/30 Yas: 14/28 Steamspiders: 10/35 Drakkar: 18/26 Vordak: 17/25 Itikar: 17/30 Hammerfist the Armourer: 18/30 Sharnazim Underlord: 18/28 Crypt Spawn: 24/40 Drakkar Kraan-Rider: 20/28 Armoury Guard: 16/22 Vestibule Guard: 15/23 Palace Jailer: 14/21 Dhorgaan: 20/40 Darklord Haakon: 28/45 I'll send my second installment containing the numbers for the Magnakai series tomorrow. If, for some reason, no one finds this stuff interesting and doesn't want two or three more posts full of this stuff, then e-mail me and tell me to STOP IT!!!!! Jason 6) Pirates: 18/27 (7) Flood of Giant Rats: 15/80 River Pirates: 19/28 Giant Fist: 10/42 Deldenian River Pirate: 17/23 Black Lakeweed: 10/50 Grave Robbers: 17/32 Lekhor: 16/30 Backstabbers: 18/25 Zagothal: 29/28 Town Sergeant: 18/27 Vampire Bats: 19/32 Thief: 16/21 Rahkos: 18/30 Bodyguards: 18/34 Hound of Death: 22/40 Redbeard: 19/28 Oudakon: 20/29 Pirate Berserkers: 20/30 Oudagorg: ??/?? Ravenous Warhound: 17/25 Trap-webs: 14/34 Varetta City Watch: 18/35 Flame-man: 14/40 Varetian Mercenaries: 26/35 Invisible Whipmaster: 24/26 Acolytes of Vashna: 22/48 Hactaraton Brood: 15/28 Armoured Assassin: 24/26 Giant Hactaraton: 22/60 Chanda the Taxidermist: 17/24 Dhax: 25/32 Roark: 24/30 Dhax: 20/28 Altan: 30/50 (*archery contest) Dhax: 27/35 Sewer Door: 13/35 Tunnel Door: 19/50 Yawshath: 22/38 Beastman Gaoler: 17/22 Dakomyd: 25/50 Zahda Beastmen: 28/35 Zahda Beastmen: 30/35 Lord Zahda: 25/45 Lord Zahda (with power-staff): 33/45 (8) Bourn the Bowyer: 19/24 (9) Roctopus: 18/18 Ghagrim: 23/38 Drunken Mercenary: 15/26 Xlorg: 22/30 Anarian Sky-snake: 23/28 Anapheg: 18/50 Anarian Rangers: 32/38 Rahgu: 23/33 Senate Guards: 28/32 Monks of the Sword: 22/31 Pickpocket: 17/25 Monks of the Sword: 25/45 Giak Scouts: 15/20 Hunting Dogs: 15/25 Drakkar Assault-troopers: 30/42 Rogue Miner: 17/25 Doomwolf: 18/26 Boran: 20/29 Gourgaz: 23/34 Vordak: 18/26 Deldenian Mercenaries: 26/34 Vordak 1: 22/28 Zaaryx Ghoul: 19/27 Vordak 2: 21/26 Ghoul Pack: 24/35 Vordaks: 28/40 Psi-ghoul: 20/30 Vordaks: 23/30 Cave Leekhon: 27/38 Silver Swamp Python: 20/60 Crocaryx: 12/38 Taan-spider: 18/52 6 Doomwolves and Giak Riders: Korkuna: 20/36 38/56 Kezoor: 28/45 Zakhan Kimah: 44/50 Gnaag Helghast: 34/48 I'll send the rest either tonight or tomorrow. I have to stop now because I have to go to a meeting. By the way, I know someone posted the Oudagorg's stats, but apparently I never wrote them down. Could someone reinform me? Jason (10) Krorn: 20/33 (11) Agtah: 26/38 Krorn Pack: 23/60 Agtah: 21/27 Krorn: 23/35 Agtah-hound: 20/25 Taintor Wolf: 27/49 Striped Agtah: 24/35 Taintor Wolf (wounded): 21/36 Agtah Scouts: 26/21 Partisans: 24/36 Octagtah: 12/43 Partisan Horseman: 17/24 Amphibian Agtah: 30/56 Partisan Horsemen: 28/32 Agtah Packleader: 27/32 Lapillibore: 16/50 Ookor: 21/45 Bhakish: 21/28 Yoacor: 30/40 Gorodon: 29/36 Tazgar Worm: 22/28 Akataz: 27/43 Giant Guakor Lizard: 23/42 Akataz Pack: 28/45 Haagadar Sewer Snake: 25/41 Halgar: 24/30 Zhenga: 35/42 Ciquali: 29/36 Shadow Reavers: 25/40 Drakkarim: 22/32 Shadow Reavers (corporeal): 34/40 Hammerlander: 24/31 Scarlet Warrior: 29/38 Hammerlanders: 29/40 Chaos-rats: 26/62 Cener Ghosts: 32/40 Chaos-master (badly wounded): Death Knight: 24/40 40/58 Elite Death Knights: 42/48 Chaos-master (lightly wounded): Zagganozod: 24/35 47/68 Drakkar Assault-Captain: 31/35 Villains of Sommerlund: 38/46 Roark: 18/20 Vonotar the Traitor (with Power Ziran: 25/33 Ring): 30/21 Ziran (with Powerstave): 40/50 Baron Shinzar (with Ogg-kor-kaggaz): 40/50 Demonlord Tagazin: 45/65 (12) Giaks: 19/27 (21) City Guards: 33/35 Giak Sentries: 17/22 Svolta: 37/36 Giak Archers: 14/22 Shadakine Raiders: 36/40 Aarnak Giaks: 23/27 Slave trader's henchmen:33/36 Drakkarim Marine: 19/23 Dar-Isun: 39/38 Drakkar Marine: 23/27 Dromodon: 44/39 Drakkarim Assault Squad: 33/48 Otokh: 40/40 Drakkarim Escorts: 26/34 Deathstalker (wounded): 38/36 Drakkarim Marines: 29/40 Deathstalker (stunned): 38/38 Drakkar: 19/26 Deathstalker (grazed): 39/38 Drakkar Gunner: 19/25 Deathstalker: 40/40 Drakkar Marine Officer: 27/38 Deathstalker (mate): 42/40 Death Knight Sentinel: 28/29 Ironclad Bosun: 20/26 (23) Tehda Stables Guard: 24/24 Vladoka: 28/35 Bavazanur: 38/35 Plaak: 30/10 Cavalian bandits: 40/36 Ictakko: 25/35 Sadanzo's sorcerous blades: 46/20 Mind Reaper: 30/36 Sadanzo's knights: 45/38 Helgedad Ghouls: 23/32 Zhakka: 42/36 Liganim: 25/26 Hunting party: 47/40 Minions of Taktaal: 31/43 Knight Bachelor & 6 Citadel Giak Wagon-guard: 16/19 gaolers: 43/38 Crypt Spawn Flood: 30/36 Robber Knights of Voshno: 47/50 Egorgh: 24/30 Peutrimax (with magical sword): Sea-scavenger: 22/10 53/38 Xaghash: 32/42 Baron Sadanzo (with Gem of Naar): Xargath: 10/10 54/36 Xargath: 32/100 Darklord Taktaal (wounded): 36/40 Darklord Kraagensk{l (wounded): 30/29 Darklord Kraagensk{l (without Helshezag): 35/38 Darklord Kraagensk{l: 45/48 Darklord Gnaag: 50/70 (24) Guard Dog: 25/18 (25) Wolfhound Handler: 29/32 Vorka: 38/36 Hammerland Bandits: 32/36 Frenzied Vorka: 46/46 Kraan (wounded): 32/38 Frenzied Vorka: 40/38 Helkona Kraan: 38/40 Vorka (wounded): 36/34 Helkona Drakkarim: 30/35 Vorka Rune Defenders: 40/35 Helkona Direflies: 40/35 Armoured Vorka: 48/46 Helkona Drakkar: 25/30 Duadon River Serpent: 40/32 Helkona Xaghash: 52/58 Eldenoran Horse-scouts: 38/36 Drakkarim Assault Squad: Elite Rune Hall Guard: 38/32 Skryza: 48/40 Sinistrari Captain (unarmoured): Fydakzh: 52/58 48/30 Urgaroh: 42/40 Ogron (with Warhammer): 42/42 Xaol's Skeleton Guards: 45/35 3 Eldenoran Deserters: 37/32 Xaol the Necromancer (with Zorkaan the Soultaker: 58/46 Serpent Rod): 50/40 Xaol Zombie (possessed by Zorkaan): 55/43 (26) Giant Steamspider: 48/45 Antah Wasps: 40/40 Tomb of Andarin: 50/50 Rock Golem: 40/70 Shom'zaa minions: 33/38 Shom'zaa minions: 38/42 Shom'zaa Agarashi: 40/30 Shom'zaa Agarashi: 44/44 Shom'zaa Agarashi Lancers: 44/40 Shom'zaa Agarashi Lancers (in battle frenzy): 48/40 Shom'zaa Agarashi (with spears): 45/40 Shom'zaa Agarashi & Commander: 50/55 Shom'zaa Agarashi Lancer: 44/30 Shom'zaa Agarashi (with Drodarin battle-axes): 44/32 Shom'zaa Agarashi (assault group): 48/42 Shom'zaa: 56/50 (27) Parade Ground Guards: 36/39 Bhanarian Bridge Guards: 32/30 Bhanarian Guards: 37/40 Bhanarian Roughriders: 38/41 Bhanarian Guards & Gunners: 40/40 Bavazanur Leader: 42/40 Sligza: 49/22 Xanon Leader: 46/42 Captain Gildas (psychically possessed): 48/40 THE KAI WISDOM MAILING LIST Jason Valasek: 8/20 Gavin Gallot: 10/15 John Marino: 7/19 Duane Bowker: 5/18 Rick Grotzky: 8/16 Derek Jackson: 2/10 Markus Tan Sien Hwong: 11/18 Blake Tucker: 8/15 Mark J Laird: 12/16 Alex Butts: 9/20 Andrew Drummer: 10/15 Shane Russell: 8/14 Luke Goaman-Dodson: 0/35 Jonathan Blake: 14/17 Rick Kreitlein: 15/25 It appears that out of all of us, young Luke can take the most punishment, but won't be dishing out much of nything. Although I do think 35 is a little steep. I think you'd lose like 15 or 20 EPs for getting run over by a truck. And it looks like none of us want to mess with Mr. Kreitlein. Maybe Lynx can take him...? :~) Thank you all for cooperating. I should get some enemies from the GM series, but those books are home. I'll put up some of the more powerful enemies (Cadak, Ixiataaga, Kekataag, etc.) in a couple weeks, when I'll have the books here with me. Jason On my unending trek to compare the power of the enemies, I seem to have lost a couple in the shuffle. I know the Madman from book 1 is CS 11 EP 10. I forget the stats for the Zadragon (thanks, Mark), but it is quite, uh... husky, to say the least. I think 48/52, but don't quote me on that. Jason Zadragon is 43/58, actually harder than Zakhan Kimah, IMHO - the fact that Zadragon's CS is 1 point lower is less important than the fact that he has 8 more EP, since for a lot of Lone Wolfs the CS difference will work out to the same column on the combat table anyway, while you still have to take away eight more EP from the dragon. By the way, to the guy who asked about the Oudagorg, according to Grotzky on DALnet it was 24/30. (Until then, I always simply considered that combat automatically won and turned to 209 without fighting (though I did not take any +1 EP for curing, since I did consider it a combat section anyway. actually, I never have curing in Book 7, since I always use the first two books to finish the Lore-Circle of the Spirit)) Attention Kai Lords, As I've previously mentioned (to some of you at least), I will be going away next week on a three week holiday. This will allow me some time to process your 'orders' (thanks for filling out the survey), as well as tracking down these elusive books (I'm well underway). I have a deal currently underway for the spare copy of #22 The Buccaneers of Shadaki with a Kai Lord who shall remain nameless (needless to say, we've struck a prestiguos deal). If I come across any more books, escpecially #22 and #19, I will snap them up. So far, the current list in order of requiring is as follows 1: The Buccaneers of Shadaki 2: Wolf's Bane 3: The Deathlord of Ixia 4: Mydnight's Hero 5: Rune War 6: The rest, (i've forgotten them, but I do have them on record) I have spare copies of #3,4,5 on the list above, and I am working out who will be the lucky Kai Lord to obtain them. I currently have spare copies of Fire on the Water, The Chasm of Doom and Shadow on the Sand. All the books I have mentioned in this message are the unabridged UK - Commonwealth editions. If anybody wants any of the three unclaimed books above, drop me a line, though I won't be able to get in touch with you for 3 weeks. The holiday will also allow me to write up a pricing scheme. As mentioned in a previous message, I will not work for profit, but I would like compensation for shipping, postage and handling, price of book etc. I will research all these costs, and put up an appropriate price list upon my return. When I've selected the people whom I will send the books out to, I will drop them a line, and organise the final arrangements. I gather that most people on this mailing list come from: USA, Canada, UK, Australia, NZ and I think Singapore. If there are others, please let me know. I will endeavour to do the best I can on this quest (I now know how Lone Wolf felt when he undertook the quest of finding the Lorestones of Nyxator), as my survey proclaims that many people are yet to experience the full enjoyment of Joe Dever's fabulous series. Thanks, for your time Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) Here are the Kai Disiplines, converted into AD&D. Camouflage Can Hide in Shadow at 10% per level. Progression stops at 10th level. Chance is halved in urban areas. Can determine whether a hiding place is safe with a successful Wis check. Can addopt the manerisms of a group of people after observing them for 5 minutes and making a sucessful Int. Check. Hunting Gains the hunting and survival NWP usable in any terrain except wastelands and desert. +1 to any suprise checks. +1 to any save that involves fast reactions. Sixth Sense Can detect imminate danger. When Kai Lord is in danger, DM rolls a Wis check. If successful, DM must inform player that there is danger and what direction it is comming from. Can be used to determine the general purpous (5 words max) of an object of person. Must roll a successful Wis check. This ability is blocked by mental or magical defenses. Can be used to determine if someone is lying. Must roll a Wis check. This ability is blocked by mental or magical defenses. Tracking Gains the Tracking and Direction Sense NWP. Tracks as a ranger. Healing Kai Lord regenerates at 1 hp/hour. Once per level per day, the Kai Lord can immediatelt heal 1d3 points of damage to himself or others. Weaponskill Gains a +1 to hit and damage with one tight group of weapons. Mindshield Can block up to 2 points per round of modifires or damage inflicted by mental attack. Mindblast Can cause an unprotected enemy to suffer 2 points of modifires to the following: attack and damage rolls or AC. Can also directly attack for one point of damage per round. Animal Kinship Gains the Animal Lore NWP. Can also try to communicate with animals. A successful Int check is required. Mind over Matter Can cause any object under 3 pound to move automaticaly. After 3 pounds, a Wis Check is required. Every pound above 3 gives a -1 penalty to the Wis roll. >Whilst leafing through an early publication of a lone wolf book, I saw an >advertisement, proclaiming there was Lone Wolf adventures (#1 & #2) for some >shifty old computer like the ZX spectrum. I was wondering if any Kai Lords >across the globe have had any encounters with this software. I do not want >to buy it, I'm just interested in finding out how good it was (I realise >that 10 years ago, computer and gaming technology was limited) in comparison >to the gamebooks. > >Black Death > > I believe this was discussed a while ago but I didn't jump in then. I have played both of those games on the real thing back in 1986 (they weren't new then I think, I borrowed them from a friend). They had keyboard overlays which showed which buttons did what moves. Not that the games was very actionpacked, they had very simplistic gameplay following the books paragraphs (showing them on screen as well!) skipping some not so necessary ones. At least "Fire On The Water" can be found for ZX Spectrum emulators, I have not found "Flight from the dark yet". "Mirror of death" is an actiongame for the speccy(emulator) that is available too if you are going to make the effort and get en emulator. I can recommend zx32 available on the homepage http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Bay/9932/ Sincerely Morkeleb Here are my interpretations of all the gamebook titles... Flight From the Dark--Self-explanitory Fire on the Water--The burning Death Hulk fleet maybe? The Caverns of Kalte--Self-explanitory The Chasm of Doom--The same Shadow on the Sand--Ditto The Kingdoms of Terror--I believe it means that entire Stornlands area since it is always plagued by war Castle Death--Again, the same THe Jungle of Horrors--I always thought it was a swamp, but alas.... The Cauldron of Fear--The Cauldron itself, or what is within? Or perhaps Kimah is what we fear...(I know I do!) The DUngeons of Torgar--Yep... The Prisoners of Time--I agree that it refers to the Villians and Vonotar. The Masters of Darkness--Who?? (Just kidding!) The Plagu---you know.... THe Captives of Kaag--The undead minions that you meet that direct you to Banedon are referred to as captives I believe. THe Darke Crusade--*sigh* The Legacy of Vashna--Stretching it a bit, but yes. The Deathlord of Ixia--Good ol' Ixy himself. Dawn of the Dragons--THey are Lavas, but the dragons are not on Magnamund, nor are they "dawned" upon..I dunno. Wolf's Bane--Imposter... The Curse of Naar--Not "Naar's Curse" I believe it refers to the beginning, where Naar has abducted the Moonstone and is using it for evil. Voyage of the Moonstone--Well, the first half anyway. Buccaneers of Shadaki--Self-explanitory Mydnight's Hero--Once you've read it, it'll make sense. Rune War--Kind of ambiguous but true. Trail of the Wolf--I would have preferred Trial of the Wolf, but oh well.. The Fall of Blood Mountain--Except I don't believe it fell... Vampirium--There was another vampire, that woman that sings to you and hypnotises you...oh and Sejanoz too. Take care, Rick Grotzky--http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arena/5437/ Laurent Bercot wrote: > And quoting Jean-Francois Besner : > > I will clarify my point. The Contact example was just to give a more graphic > > representation of Shadow Gate, Vortex, WormHole, ... A WormHole have different points > > of entry both in Space and Time. > > Meaning, a WormHole can get you from galaxy A to galaxy B. > > All right. Your wormhole definition is okay. > > > Or from the Daziarn to Aon. > > Here I disagree. It's not, repeat, NOT the same thing, to > cross galaxies and to change universes. > I believe there are two kinds of Shadowgates. The ones that > I call "internal", which make you reappear in your starting > universe, just like the first one WB and LW cross in Book 19 > to go to the Devon satellite, which is located in Aon. > AND the ones that I call "external", which make you reappear > in a _different_ universe, where you just CANNOT go by any > other means. For example, Shadowgates that lead to the > Daziarn, or to Naar's universe. Or to Ishir's and Kai's > universe, if only such Shadowgates would exist. ( It > would be SO great if they did. ) > > In the former case, you may compare time, because the departure > and arrival points are located in the same universe. In the > latter case, I can't see the reason for any relation between > the times of the two different universes. Except that you can't > get back before you've left, of course. > > But here is an interesting idea : > > > As for the Time differences, they must be compare > > to the same point comparison. Meaning, when LW get into the Daziarn, he could be 20 > > years into the futur compare to the date he fell into the Shadow Gate in Torgar. When, > > he gets back, he is actually traveling back in Time by 12 years. Making a grand total > > of 8 years in the futur plus the couples of days he spent in the Daziarn. > > Yes, I really like the idea. Although it doesn't seem really > suitable for an "internal" Shadowgate, because it would allow you > to just "waste time" disappearing into nothingness and then > reappearing 20 years later somewhere in the same universe, it > looks like a good model for "external" Shadowgates. > > I have one objection though : you're in A, you cross a Shadowgate > that's sending you 6 years forth into B, you spend a year in B, > and you cross a Shadowgate that's sending you 8 years back into A. > That means you're back into A one kaidamned year before you left, > doesn't it ? And THAT shouldn't be allowed at all by your > time-warping laws. We can forbid Shadowgates that send back in time, > but it will mean you can only go forth and waste time in either way, > and situations like "I spend a year in B and only 6 months have > elapsed when I'm back in A" won't ever happen, which is much too > restrictive for me. > > That's why I'm clinging to my "unrelated speed of timeflow between > different universes" idea for now, but I'm interested in that > wormhole thing. > Any suggestions ? > > > As for Contact, she got there with almost no Time differences but the WormHole that got > > her back was "fixed" in Time thus brought her back at the same time she fell in. > > So wormholes are naturally two-way ? What about the Shadowgate in > Torgar, the one in Haadaagar ? When you reappear, there is no trace > of an inconsistency of the universe. No Shadowgate around. No, > I believe Shadowgates are one-way, and the ones that are two-way, > for example the ones Naar creates, are always temporary and do NOT > induce any change in the flow of time. Remember the trip in Naar's > Universe in Book 16 ? When you're back, time has flown normally, so > that you've still got all of the Vashna disciples to take care of :) > > Maybe we should distinguish between constant, natural, "strong" > Shadowgates, like the ones LW crosses in Book 11, and temporary, > artificially created, "weak" ( = no influence on time ) Shadowgates. > We can't compare the laws of physics with a work of fiction. Joe Dever changes he rules to make the story more interesting. Book 11 would just be one section if he hasn't: Section 1:As you emerge out, you find yourself in another world. You turn back and see the exit of the Shadow Gate. You go back and hope it will bring you back to Magnamund. Find out what happen to Lone Wolf in his next adventure: The Masters of Darkness. Very cheap, don't you think. Yes, WormHoles are two ways. Also, the example Laurent gave us is possible but it would make a pretty weird story. > > > I'm a fan of astrophysics. > > I hope my theories haven't shocked you too much :) > Nope > > May you receive the blessings of Kai and Ishir > > May the sun watch over your sleep and the moon give you > light and force for the day. Or is it the opposite ? ;) > Laurent Bercot ( mailto:Laurent.Bercot@irisa.fr ) May you receive the blessings of Kai and Ishir Sleeping Bear BOTTS wrote: > Nevertheless, an interesting thought comes to mind...Vonotar was cast into > the shadow gate a few years (Magnamund time) before Lone Wolf arrived in > the Darziarn. But, for Vonotar...it was but a couple of days. Thus, to > Vonotar, it was but a week ago that Lone Wolf captured him and cast him > into that world. Imagine Vonotar's thoughts on seeing Lone Wolf...Lone > Wolf would be much stronger, more more disciplined, much older, and yet it > was but all this and only a week had passed! > > > Jeff I don't think it's possible not because of the science involved but because of the story itself. How could Vonotar became the master of the City Haagadar, round up the 5 criminals, get that Power Ring, build a small army to guard the City, found that Scarlet Warrior, and create a spy network of some sort which told him of the arrival of the 2 Stones of Nyxator? Vonotar was maybe a powerful magician but that powerful. Comments? May you receive the blessings of Kai and Ishir Sleeping Bear I would have to agree with Sleeping Bear. When Lone Wolf meets the Villians of Sommerlund, Vonotar says something like, "Long have I waited for my vengeance on you, Lone Wolf." (I'm paraphrasing here). That doesn't match with his only being there for a few days. > Well, SB, a few things: > > 1. The books SAY it's a few days. Out of curiosity, where does it say that? I would be interested in looking it up if I am wrong. :) > 2. The army was already there, I think. The refugees from the Daziarn OR > people cast into the shadow gates? > > btw, does that scarlet guy's sword actually do anything? Or is it another > "Red herring"? Um, it's a really cool weapon (although not magical). :) I carried it around for most of the Grandmaster series until it was taken from me in Duadon. It doesn't do anything. It's just a fancy looking weapon. BTW, does anyone else think it odd that the Duadon soldiers took all of Lone Wolf's normal weapons, but left him the Sommerswerd and the Silver Bow of Duadon? I would think the Sommerswerd would be the *first* thing they took from him. :) Mark > How many of Lone Wolfs 'friends' have died in the series so far? > > In book 1 there was obviously His entire monastry, but there was also Prince > pelethar. > In book2, there was Rhygar, Cpt Kelman, Admiral Calfen and who was the first > mate of the Cardinal (ronan or something?) (What happened to the other > travelling companions on the coach) > Book3, the 2 guides > Book4.....hmmm my memory begins to fail me > > > Later on in the Series...paido, cyrlis (or whatever his name was)....someone > fill in the extensive gaps here............... > > Let's see... Book 3 there were three guides, and they only died if you went a certain way. 4--Some border Rangers 5--The Vassagonian crew and envoy. 6--Cyrilus 7--Possibly that tunnel-runner guy..Tavin or something?? 8--Umm...almost Paido. 9--The President of Tahou and Senator Chil. 10--Adamas and Paido 11--T'uk T'ron I think and that other guide... 12--Crew members... **More later** Rick Hi everybody, Black Death has returned. This letter may be lengthy, but please read through it. In case you are wondering, I had an enjoyable holiday, and managed to get a few more books to put on my 'catalog'. I am in the process of contacting all of you out there on Magnamund who have requested books. I have also been drowned in e-mail, some 250 meassages have been sent through kaiwisdom! It is going to take me some time to back up to date, so please excuse any late replies. Also included in this e-mail are several thoughts that may need discussion. Firstly, I remind you that if you or your friends need any Lone Wolf or any other gamebooks for that matter, see me. Right now I have 3 spare copies of Grey Star #1, and Freeway Warrior #1 going for bargain prices, as well as an assortment of regular Lone Wolf gamebooks. Speaking of bargains, I picked up an extra set of the Fabled Lands series. I open the bidding up at $40 Australian ($AUD). In case you are unaware, The Fabled Lands series was written 3 years ago by Jamie Thompson and Dave Morris, who have both had extensive careers in the gaming industry. The beauty of the Fabled Lands series is that you can travel throughout the books in any way you wish, it's sort of a 'real time' adventure. Anyway, only books 1-6 have ever been published, if anyone has information regarding books 7-12, please contact me IMMEDIATELY! This is definitely my favourite gamebook series (except for Lone Wolf, of course), and I urge you to discover the world of the Fabled Lands. I'm sure this series would have won plenty of awards 10-15 years ago, during the height of the gamebook craze. Points of discussion: How is it possible for your initial combat skill (CS) to be significantly reduced? My point being is that as an Archmaster who has the Curing ability can gain 20 Endurance points (every 100 days) if their combat skill falls to 6 or below. I am also interested (as would every other member of kaiwisdom) into what people believe are the 'real world' equivalences of the countries of Magnamund. Here are my views, and supporting evidence. Sommerlund - England (Where Joe Dever is based would be an obvious choice for the homeland of his hero) Durenor - Scotland or Ireland (As Legends #2 states that the Durenese speak a dialect similar to the Sommlending, and also look similar) Stornlands - Central Europe, based around the River Storn (Rhinelands) Lyris - France (nearest country to England / Sommerlund Bear with me here!!!! Eldenora - Germany (although on the opposite side of the Storn to Germany to the Rhine, The Eldenorans have been portrayed as a warlike people, wanting to conquer the other lands, similar to the jingoistic sentiment of Germany earlier this century - my apologies to any germans on this mailing list) Salony - Austria Slovia - Italy (prancing horse emblem) Delden - Spain? Vassagonia - Arabia (and surrounds, pretty obvious I guess) Darklands - Russia (as it is a massive nation, mostly wasteland, and Lone Wolf was originally written during the cold war, with possible anti-Russian sentiment) Darkland allies - Skaror, Ghatan ( Eastern bloc soviet supporters, for reasons mentioned above) Shadakine nations - Asia (again pretty obvious) Siyen - Possibly USA, Canada, Australia or New Zealand ( similar people to the Sommlending, share similar interests etc.) Others I can't think of, but please forward your opinions to kaiwisdom How old is King Ulnar now? Surely he must be on his last knees, he wasn't a spring chicken in MS 5050 was he, plus he has never been top the daziarn or any other feature that may have prolonged his life. By the way, who is the next in line to the throne - Baron Tor Medar? he's no spring chicken either. Having just read Grey Star #3, I found the world in the daziarn quite different to the one portrayed in the Prisoners of Time, with the exception of the realm of Paradox, and the Chaosmaster of course. Comments? Finally, why does the Legends series call the Daziarn the Dazhiarn? Sorry about my spelling, hope to catch you individually to finalise these book orders soon. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) >How is it possible for your initial combat skill (CS) to be significantly >reduced? My point being is that as an Archmaster who has the Curing ability >can gain 20 Endurance points (every 100 days) if their combat skill falls to >6 or below. I personally think that this is a misprint. The discription for Deliverance follows: " ... their Endurance is reduced to 8 points or less, ..." Now lets see - in book 9 didn't it say LW was going to be the king if Ulnar died until a heir was found¿ >Having just read Grey Star #3, I found the world in the daziarn quite >different to the one portrayed in the Prisoners of Time, with the exception >of the realm of Paradox, and the Chaosmaster of course. Comments? Well, that's because GS #3 takes place (almost¿) entirely in the Neverness, but LW is only briefly inside the Neverness. I always found this topic rather fascinating applying the philosophy to all of my favourite fantasy worlds such as Narnia,Titan,and the Warhammer world .However I always based the designation of equivalent parts on cultural characteristics and also geographical similarities hence the corresponding physical characteristics of the humans living in that environment.Regarding your points of discussion I had a slightly different opinion of Slovia which I always associated with Russia.The description of this people living in the grasslands of Slovia reminded me of people living in the Russian steppes....their dark hair,moustaches and perhaps ante-gambling laws!Anyone familiar with the Warhammer world would understand if i thought them similar to the Kislevites except for the fact that Slovia I think is definitely warmer!When associating nation-fantasy with nation- reality (though perhaps Magnamund exists as well!) I tend to use cultural aspects more than poltical/historical reasons but that is just the perspective I choose to take which explains the above explanation. >Delden - Spain? Good job. I like to think of cities such as Firina and Nikesa corresponding to Madrid-cultural, bazaarish places. Telchos, in my opinion, could correlate to the ancient Amazon culture. They are a gynarchy, after all... >Vassagonia - Arabia (and surrounds, pretty obvious I guess) >Darklands - Russia (as it is a massive nation, mostly wasteland, and Lone >Wolf was originally written during the cold war, with possible anti-Russian >sentiment) >Darkland allies - Skaror, Ghatan ( Eastern bloc soviet supporters, for >reasons mentioned above) >Shadakine nations - Asia (again pretty obvious) Also Bhanar and Chai-both have Asian looking peoples and Chai in particular has Asian place names. >Siyen - Possibly USA, Canada, Australia or New Zealand ( similar people to >the Sommlending, share similar interests etc.) Probably US. Power, but very distant ally. >Others I can't think of, but please forward your opinions to kaiwisdom > >How old is King Ulnar now? Surely he must be on his last knees, he wasn't a >spring chicken in MS 5050 was he, plus he has never been top the daziarn or >any other feature that may have prolonged his life. By the way, who is the >next in line to the throne - Baron Tor Medar? he's no spring chicken either. > >Having just read Grey Star #3, I found the world in the daziarn quite >different to the one portrayed in the Prisoners of Time, with the exception >of the realm of Paradox, and the Chaosmaster of course. Comments? > They're in different realms. Grey Star takes place mainly in the Neverness, Realm of Paradox, Meledor and other 'off the map' areas. We don't see the Neverness or Realm of Paradox in PRISONERS OF TIME, but we do see other places such as Vozhada, etc. Thus, you can see that the Daziarn varies wildly from place to place and since both are in different locales... >Finally, why does the Legends series call the Daziarn the Dazhiarn? > I believe it's John Grant's spelling. Check the glossary to see that Daziarn = Dazhiarn. Regarding Tristan's numerous points of discussion: >How is it possible for your initial combat skill (CS) to be >significantly reduced? My point being is that as an Archmaster who >has the Curing ability can gain 20 Endurance points (every 100 days) >if their combat skill falls to 6 or below. I think Joe meant your Endurance. It makes more sense that way. It's like a second wind - if your EP falls below 6, then add 20 to your EP score for a second lease on life. >I am also interested (as would every other member of kaiwisdom) into >what people believe are the 'real world' equivalences of the >countries of Magnamund. Kalte - either Scandanavia/Greenland or Antarctica Chai is very obviously China. The almond-shaped eyes, the Chinese-sounding names of cities, etc. If you take a real good look at the whole continent of Magnamund, it sort of resembles Pangaea. You know, the huge continent that used to cover the earth in prehistoric times? Look at southern Magnamund especially. The Shadakine Empire (see the map of a Grey Star book) can be almost perfectly superimposed on top of the United States. Port-of-Suhn is the equivalent of New Orleans, the Forbidden Valley could be Death Valley, and Shadaki looks like it could be New York City or Washington, DC. And the peninsula of the Azanam looks an awful lot like Mexico. The Isle of Lorn could be a Caribbean island. Point taken about the typo. i initially thought the same too. Also with the magnamund nations, what do you think about the Elder Magi being Jews? They share similar views, and they both had their famous exodus? Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) I can sort of see Tristan's point on the similarities between the Jews and the Elder Magi. Wasn't there some type of plague that nearly wiped out the Magi, sort of like the Holocaust? And I think it would be cool if Joe Dever joined this list under an assumed name or something. Don't let us know, don't even post. But then he'd know what we are all thinking about the little multiverse that he has created. Jason Some different ( personal, subjective, etc.) thoughts about the 'real world equivalents' to Magnamund's countries: First of all: Sommerlund: I always had Skandinavia (no specific country, though) in mind. Something with this special 'Viking/Norse' touch. Durenor: According to the quality of Durenese Weapons and especially their Longbows, I would say England (remember Agincourt?) Stornlands: Germany during the Thirty-Years-War. LW 6 gives a vivid picture of the war-torn, ruined landscape ravaged by mercenaries. A very immersive background. No idea about single countries except: Slovia: The Steppes of Asia and Southern Russia, for centuries bringing forth lots of tribes on horseback. The Map in LW 9 shows some Slovian towns bearing some resemblance to Russian. Vassagonia: Egypt meets Arabia Darklands and their Allies: Pure Fantasy I wouldn't call the fertile Russian soil wasteland ;-) Shadaki and surroundings: Asia (Far East) Lots of other countries: Fantasy Originally, I blamed the CS-mistake in the descriptions of the Magnakai disciplines to the translator. Still, it seems clear that EPs are meant. Mad Dog (aka Hauke Murr) Point taken about Slovia being like Russia. With towns like Lovka and the like, I suppose that point is justified. I guess I just got out of control with my thoughts Joe Dever might have been involved with a Cold War conspiracy, blaming all on the all conquering Darklands (Russia!!!). Slovia's prancing horse really confuses me. Shouldn't it be a hammer and sickle!!!! Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) I hate to be a pain in the butt, but here's my opinions: Flight from the Dark - the Dark being a metaphor for Evil (Darklords) Fire on the Water - the various references to the sea Caverns of Kalte - pretty obvious Chasm of Doom - Maakengorge Shadow on the Sand - lot of desert in Vassagonia Kingdoms of Terror - Representing as a whole the nations of the Stornlands, although there aren't many kingdoms, but their are principalities, duchies, republics etc. Castle Death - Kazan Oud - need I say more? Jungle of Horrors - Danarg Cauldron of Fear - The horrors of the Tahou Cauldron Dungeons of Torgar - straightforward Prisoners of Time - subject to much criticism, but I believe that the Daziarn is literally tha place that has no time. Therefore the 'people' that time neglected can be viewed as prisoners. Masters of Darkness - Darklords Plague Lords of Ruel - Cener Druids Captives of Kaag - Yes, one captive (Banedon) and being a city-fortress, Kaag would have had numerous dungeons for prisoners and spawn alike. Lone Wolf too could be viewed as a captive (don't criticise me on that - you know what I mean!) The Darke Crusade - the Lencian Crusade on the city of Darke - realm of Nyvoz Legacy of Vashna - If Vashna had have been summoned, Magnamund would have paid for it! Deathlord of Ixia - what it says Dawn of the Dragons - the dragopns at the end. However, I don't think it is an appropriate title as the book covers Lone Wolf transgressing the many realms of Magnamund, and only slightly focusses on his battle with the dragons near the end. Wolf's Bane - Lone Wolf's arch nemesis Curse of Naar - I believe that the Curse is just Naar itself Voyage of the Moonstone - pretty obvious Buccaneers of Shadaki - not too many buccaneers appear in the book, could also represent thae Shadakine people Mydnight's Hero - the Grandmaster really didn't save the city of Mydnight. It could refer to Prince (sorry, King) Karvas' time in exile. Rune War - Wars of the Rune. Trail of the Wolf - the Grandmaster had to find Lone Wolf. Fall of Blood Mountain - that evil creature held its base in Blood Mountain. Vampirium - The phenomenon of Sejanoz > You know in the Grand Master books it says under Kai-alchemy > "As you advance in rank, so will your knowledge and mastery of > Left-Handed Magic increase, enabling you to craft new Kai > weapons and artefacts." > I thought you could do this with Kai-weaponcraft? Sure. Once you become a Supreme Master. > And what about > the Kai artefacts? Anyone shed some light on this? Hmmm. Other than the Kai Weapons, and possibly the Sommerswerd and Lorestones (but these came before the Kai Lords), might anything else fall into this category? As far as creating "artefacts", I would think that Lone Wolf would be the first to be able to do this, since no other Kai Lord had advanced beyond Grand Mastership. Though I suppose previous Grand Masters could possibly have taken up left-handed magic on the side. Like maybe a night course at Toran Community College. :) rob > At 08:46 AM 9/09/98 -0700, you wrote: > >Cool. Thanks Tristan. > > > >How old are you? I am trying to get a feel for the people on this list, > >and the flurry of flames lately indicate younger people. But one fellow > >is 28 at least. I am 26. > > > >Well, I hope you find those three books! Again, I will be very > >grateful if you can send them to me. > > > >Blake > Hey Blake, > In regards to your question, I am 17 years old. There are several other > people on the mailing list who are also around a similar age. I found it > hard to believe that there was someone who was 10 on this list! I didn't > think that people that young read books anymore, well my younger brother > doesn't anyway! I have been a big fan of gamebooks for many years now, but > I > got into Lone Wolf about 4 years ago. I guess I viewed him as an 'enemy' > (or > more correctly, a competitor) to the Fighting Fantasy gamebooks. As this > supply eventually died out, I moved on to reading Lone Wolf, but I am very > disappointed that the series will end soon. Life goes on I suppose. > Speaking > of Fighting Fantasy, I gather that you work for (George) Lucas Films. I > was > wondering whether you know Ian McCaig, the former Fighting Fantasy artist? > I > read somewhere that he is part of the crew over there at Lucas Films. I am > going away next week for a 3 week holiday, you probably get a message from > kaiwisdom proclaiming this. I'll also have time sorting out all the orders > from various people, and hunting up these elusive books. > > See you later, > > Tristan Taylor > Hi Tristan- I don't know what the heck is going on with my email, but I JUST NOW got this response, which you wrote in September. Jeez. So, yes, Iain is in fact a good friend of mine. I'd forgotten it was him who had done all that. He was instrumental in our costume designs for Episode I. (see sight below) Thanks again for hunting down those books for me. Did you get my email from this AM about taking a US check? Blake Tucker http://www.starwars.com/episode-i/crew/ Page Down Twice for the Art Deparment! >>Sorry again everybody, >> >>My opinion on the Sommerswerd +8 CS bonus is that Lone Wolf's Gestalt (Soul >>Stuff) has been enhanced. The Gestalt is, after all, really what is affected >>by any bonuses. >> >>Black Death > >In that case, if LW seperates from the Sommerswerd, would he still have +8¿ > >Star Lion > No, because in order to activate that bonus, he must be in contact with the Sommerswerd, or have a significant mental bond with it. > TT I know, I'm italian so I'm not totally impartial,but I think you agree that Sommerlund is the country of the SUN...and,almost here in Europe, Italy has the reputation of "country of the sun" !!! Of course you don't agree that Sommelund is the Magnamund' equivalent of Italy...but I only want to joke : I don't agree,too !!! Italian people is (in the whole world imagination) quite different from Sommerlending (is this word right ?)people... Another note : some months ago I wrote that the word "vakeros" is quite similar to the spanish word "vacheros"(=cowboys) : any comments ? And remember that "kalt" means "cold" in German... Greetings. Storm Hawk. At 12:38 PM 9/10/98 PDT, you wrote: >>Sommerlending (is this word right ?) >It's actually Sommlending, although for the first year or so that I read >Lone Wolf, I pronounced it Sommerlending, because it makes sense that >people from SommERlund would be SommERlending, but no, they are indeed >Sommlending. >There are also Durenese, Slovarians (instead of Slovians), Varetians, >Deldenians, Bhanarians, Vakovarians, Shadakine, etc., etc. > Jason >P.S. Is "Varetian" pronounced "Va-RET-ti-an" or "Va-REESH-an"? Varetians (I say va-REESH-ans) are the inhabitants of Varetta, capital of Lyris. So technically, as a nationality, they are Lyrisians (Lie-REES-ians)! Black Death << Having been swimming around in those 250+ e-mails (yes, I'm still going) I came across the space/time/shadow gate comments. While I have nothing to say on the issue, I was wondering. If Lone Wolf found a shadow gate, spent a couple of days in the Daziarn, but that turned out to be 8 years Magnamund time, how long did Vonotar spend in the Daziarn? To my reckoning (probably not correct), Lone Wolf kicked Vonotar into the Daziarn 16 Magnamund years (I think - possibly less - I haven't read the Kai/Magnakai series for some time), Vonotar would have only been in the Daziarn for 4 days. Would that have been enough time to meet up with the super-villains (there is a lot of neverness to cover) get the Lorestone, and all those other wonderful things he did? Just a thought Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) As was discussed at another time, I believe Julian pointed out that it is very possible that the relationship is not linear. Other factors besides time in Daziarn could play into the time distortion. Perhaps different shadowgates provide different time relationships? If you look at the Grey Star series, you will find that the ratio of time spent in Daziarn to the amout of time that passed on Magnamund don't match up. I did the calculations at the end of book 11 and expected 21 years to pass or something, but it was much less. Jason Red Hunter >>Another note : some months ago I wrote that the word "vakeros" is quite >>similar to the spanish word "vacheros"(=cowboys) : any comments ? >>And remember that "kalt" means "cold" in German... >I admit I've never seen a cowboy use magic. :) Oh, and the >German word for cold is "kalte", rather than kalt. The German word for 'cold' is 'kalt' , rather than 'kalte'. But, since German adjectives are declined in conjunction with nouns, you can occasionally stumble across the form 'kalte'. This will be most likely be the case with female or plural nouns. Eg.: 'the cold blade' translates to 'die kalte Klinge', because 'Klinge' is a female noun Something more Magnamund-related: 'Kalte' is called 'Kolte' in the German translations of LW, obviously to avoid confusion. Happy freezing! Mad Dog (aka. Hauke Murr) >Oh, and the German word for cold is "kalte", rather than kalt. Actually, there are different forms of the adjective. "Kalt" is the basic form, but due to different cases and agreement, then you could end up with forms like kalte, kalten, kalter, or kaltes, just to name a few. I have a basic knowledge of German but if I am mistaken then someone correct me. Jason > Does anyone else on the list feel that there should be CS or damage bonuses > or penalties based on the type of weapon? It really makes no sense to have a > 6 inch dagger hurt as much as 4 foot broadsword. Perhaps. I can see both sides. Your point is a valid one. At the same time, let me present another opinion. I believe CS was intended to convey more than just weapons. It also includes combat situations and such. Usually, a broadsword will do much more damage than a dagger, especially when the fighters are a few feet apart. However, if the combattant with the dagger gets right next to the opponent with the broadsword, the dagger is going to do a lot more damage. Also, you can get more thrusts in with a dagger because it is much lighter and easier to swing. As for why there are not different CS bonuses for different weapons types, my guess would be that it was done that way for simplicity's sake. Occasionally, I've seen modifications to a random number pick based on the type of weapon you have (trying to cut the amulet from Tagazin's neck in book 10 comes to mind). My two crowns. :) Mark Let it be known that I love foreign languages. That's what I'm doing in college. I love all foreign languages, which is why the fictional language of Giak fascinates me so much. And so, I have decide to make a six-language dictionary, translating between Giak, English, French, Spanish, Russian, and German. Don't worry - I think it's fun, in some sick, twisted way, and I am doing this of my own accord. :~) I don't know enough Japanese to add it to the list, and I know hardly any Italian (sorry menara errico), and I think six languages is time-consuming enough. The worst part will be alphabetizing it with respect to each language. The only thing I ask of the List is the translations of certain proper names from the books. So I need the French, Spanish, German, and Russian equivalents of the following: Darklord, doomwolf, giak, Lone Wolf, Sommerswerd. Also, there are some words whose part of speech is not known (blow, border, etc.) I will translate them as if they were both noun and verb until it is proven whether it is one or the other. I also need to know the German word for "catapult." I would also like clarification on whether the Giak word for bolt means the bolt that locks a door or a bolt of lightning. I'm not sure if there are any Russians on the list, but I know the other three languages are well-represented. Thank you for your cooperation. Jason P.S.: I believe that I now have conclusive evidence that the Giak word for "heart" is "kaan." There is a regiment of Giaks known as the Stone-Hearts, or "Lajakaan." Since no Giak word begins with the "AA" letter, and since there are other instances in Giak where a double consonant is omitted (for example, the Gulf of Helenag - a compound word of hel - lenag (black - deep), that's my take on it. Jason Really a huge project! I hope I can help you with the Geman part a little bit. Darklord Schwarzer Lord doomwolf Unheilwolf giak Giak Lone Wolf Einsamer Wolf Sommerswerd Sommerswerd catapult Katapult Mad Dog (aka. Hauke Murr) Here is a little list of differences between original terms and italian terms...maybe someone want to put them in his/her (!) net-site... Kai --> Ramas Kalte --> Kaltenland Barraka --> Bakkarshan Vonotar --> Vonatar Ruanon --> Randong (in some books, Ruanon again in others) Laumspur --> Vigorilla (from vigore=vigour) Gaveweed --> Necranto (in some books, Graveweed again in others) Gallowbrush --> Dente del Sonno (=tooth of sleep) (in some books, Gallowbrush again in others) lake Kazonara (near Helgor) --> lake Kalvena Ljuk --> Knollen Raumas ruins --> rovine di Tamargo (=Tamargo ruins) I saw that some Kai weapons have different names from the original ones : soon I will make a complete list of Kai weapons names, book names, disciplines names. I think that could be a good idea to create a sort of on-line vocabolary (English,Italian,German,French,Spanish,etc) of these words in way to know always what we are speaking about !!! Maybe U.S. and U.K. are not interested but I'm thinking to all the future members of the list that could be from countries were the names are different... In summer I found some LW books (legends and adventures) in Praha (=Prague), of course czech versions !!! The're not so forward as in other countries but they're on the good way. Last note...: Italian versions of books 1-26 use Peter Andrew Jones covers I think the same appear on some sites of the web. But book 27 has another guy's cover...what did it happened ? ( So is : did U.K. version change cover-maker, too ?) Greetings. Storm Hawk p.s.: in Czech Republic Peter A. Jones covers are used on other gamebooks !!! p.p.s: I have a lot of gamebooks (about 60) (Italian versions) Maybe I make a list with comments... Menaro Really guys, As much as I would like to see a Lone Wolf movie, do you really think there is enough support out there for a big film company to spend millions of dollars on it? We are the survivors of a dying breed, my friends. Take Joe Dever for example. He wouldn't be having that much trouble with publishers if there was lots of support for Lone Wolf. In fact, publishers would be chasing him! A similar situation occurred a couple of years ago with The Phantom movie. Although originally the comic spawned in the US during the golden age of comics (1930's), support there died down, being suppresed by Batman, Superman, and a whole host of new Marvel characters. The Phantom is Australia's #1 comic (by sales figures), and being a Phantom Phan for many years (longer than I have been playing gamebooks), I was delighted when it was announced that A Phantom Movie was being made. A US film company was making it, but they didn't think it would take off, due to minimal (in comparison) support in the US, UK and other big population centres in the Western world. Australia loved it. Well, that's my thoughts. Tristan Taylor As for my favourite character, I like Cloud Maker's description and personality as detailed in Legends #3 & 5 (he's not that important in Fire on the Water). But then again, as an EVIL person (!) I like people like the Slavemaster of Aarnak (before being reformed by the Elder Magi), Warlord Magnarn, Baron Shinzar, and Zakhan Kimah! These guys really exubriate stregth and power. Why can't Sommerlund have a dictator? Then they can really teach Magnamund a lesson! Bet you didn't expect that! Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) Black Death (Tristan), We sure are a dying breed. I remember the libraries used to be working overtime to keep the Lone Wolf books intact, and on the shelves when I was in early high school. It was only the select few who chose (rather, FOUGHT over) them, and it was usually the imagination stretching, sci-fi watching, fantasy breathing nerds. I know. I was one of them. Still am I guess. :) A movie would be cool to see but it COULDN'T happen. As we all know, when directors/writers get their hands on a story they ALWAYS cut and trim to make a movie length shred of what could have been. So our Lone Wolf might miss out some of the favourite bits... Or could it be a movie with about 15 sequels? Pricey. Coz where do you stop? Once he reaches Holmgard after his initial journey? Then we'd miss out the epic trek to Durenor for the Sommerswerd, and the death of Zagarna. That's just the start. Actually, seeing as my favourite character is Banedon, I'll use his name as my sign-off. Perhaps as a Brotherhood emissary to the monastery? Banedon aka Simon Marc, As far as I know, or have seen at the local library, the Legends go up to around #15 or so. They're one behind what happens in the gamebooks so gamebook #1 Flight from the Dark refers to Legends book #2 The Dark Door Opens etc. Really well written and it's here that everyone can get the sense of how pieced together the plot really is. Joe Dever, with John Grant, is excellent as a novel writer and there's a sort of humour flowing all the way through that I think is unique to the fantasy genre. I'm not really one for collecting them myself, but when I have the chance I pick them up from second hand bookstores and little bookstores that sell them new. An interesting little aspect of them is the header picture for each chapter, which has the same artist, Brian Williams, all the way throughout each of the books. I'm a stickler for consistency. I guess it's the sort of thing someone can get into if they want to know what else happened around the time of the adventures, and what Lone Wolf was FEELING at the time. He's not just a killing machine but a young man with a heavy burden of responsibility. Similarly, I really got into The Silmarillion (JRR Tolkien) after reading the Lord of the Rings. Banedon aka Simon >As far as I know, or have seen at the local library, the Legends go up to >around #15 or so. I only thought there were 12. I have the first 5 US versions, which are really only the first 4 UK versions. I also was able to get "The Lorestone of Varetta" from that Canadian online bookstore, but I think the rest are too hard to get. If someone happens upon any Legends book #5 or higher, let me know. But just having up to "Hunting Wolf" has let me appreciate the novelisations. They are done quite well and they adhere to the books as closely as possible while supplying additional information and it lets you in to the thoughts of the characters more. And some characters, like Petra and Qinefer, aren't even in the gamebooks. I still don't know who Petra is! I think how it worked was John Grant (aka Paul Barnett) actually wrote the novels and Joe edited and proofread them to make sure they accurately followed the gamebooks. But they definitely are worth looking into. Jason Well, I just accidentally trashed Tristan Taylor's response to my e-mail about Grailquest. Oops! That's what happens when it's midnight and one has a Vancouver Film School Multimedia project due tomorrow and the printer's too slow and... Anyway, I know it's a bit off the topic of Lone Wolf, but, then, look at all of the discussion of FF on this mailing list! I won't mention any names, you know who you are. Anyhow, Tristan, to answer that e-mail, I do have "The Crypts of Terror," book 2 of Sagas of the Demonspawn. I recall in Book 6 of Grailquest journeying down into Merlin's well and finding "A couple of books about some idiot named Fire*Wolf" and being very amused by this. The Fire*Wolf book that I have is awful in terms of the magic system. I didn't really understand it at all. I know there were some other flaws with it that I don't recall right now. I need sleep. James Humphrey aka Rune Strider in Lone Wolf, Sir Pip of Avalon, and Paji Pathseeker in Star Wars Roleplaying -- Ah, who am I really? >What caused JD & GC to split? Basically what I read into it was that Gary started making demands of Joe. LW is Joes baby, always was. I guess Gary began to think that his part was greater than Joe did and maybe tried to control the story line or similar. Gary is now living in NZ, so i've been doing some hunting, I'd love to be able to publish his side. Gavin > Wow, I checked my e-mail this morning. Only 6 messages, and > only 2 of them > were through kaiwisdom! Pity I kncoked off those 250+ e-mails > yesterday. As > a point of discussion, I was wondering if any members of > kaiwisdom were a > part of the Lone Wolf Fan Club that was constantly advertised > in the back of > the UK editions. If so, tell us about what happened, when it finally > disbanded (if, indeed it did) blah blah blah. It may be lame, > but it's a > point of discussion anyway. > > Black Death > (aka Tristan Taylor) I joined the club in the early 80's. I was the 20th member and got a free t-shirt etc. The correspondence got less and less after a couple of years and by 1988 i got nothing. I know the club did continue for a few years after that but i dont think much happened Gavin It was discontinued in 1996. Moon Hawk sorry to burst any bubbles here, but ff was a pile of steaming fetid donkey kidneys. The reason Joe started Lone Wolf, was he realised that his ideas broadened the genre a billion-fold in comparison to the 7-13 year old age range of the badly cliched, ghost-written (and that's a serious insult from a serious author), mis-managed collection of unrelated and therefore uninteresting texts, in uninspired locations with banal characters, where the only thing the publishers could do to spice it up was to make glossy covers and insert pictures of creatures at the fight scenes, instead of using their head and trying to smart the series up. Then we have the Penguin Greek hero trilogy, and the Way of the Tiger (ninja) series (both very intelligent, and decent attempts at creating soemthing brand new. Pity about the art), and more recently, a new non-linear concept in game-books by the ever prolific Dave and Jamie, which sank like a stone after 6/7 hastily released books, because non-linear means non-narrative and therfore non-readership-involvement (YAWN), but nonetheless a very nice idea (but better done on computer). Also of note was (4/5 years) ago one by Gary Chalk (remember him any old Lone Wolf fans out there?), which was actually not too bad - dethroned Prince undercover in his city, ultimately attempting to regain throne. It just seemed to disappear. I won't go into the adventure-find your love-game books or Penguin game-book no.1 both aimed at the female audience, and unfortunately being so patronising they never sold (except to me through Oxfam). There were the dual books, done first (I think, no publication dates to hand) by Joe with the Baron-Warlock , Sorcerer-Enchanter pairs, and then followed up by Dave and Jamie with some decent attampts at new interaction (thogh no-one's managed a picture-story like Joe) . The Crown Of Kings FF series was good, if not too frustrating and hard, but certainly imaginative. Any others I can't remember off-hand, but they are probably sitting on my shelf 100 miles away. Anyone any discussions on what makes a good game-book? (Realising of course that Lone Wolf is the best so far) Or any old game-books worth a laugh or recomendation? Belfast-boy Paul Gray (liverpool) I remember the Tolkien/Middle Earth books and I think I have one still: it was ok, but it was a wilderness adventure where you could pretty much wander anywhere you wanted to go which made for an odd adventure. As for the AD&D books, a couple were actually fairly good, but they were few and far between. Similarly, I loved a couple of the FF books more than any one LW book, but as a series LW is much better. The Sorcery! FF series was ok, especially the whole spell book concept. Maybe you guys just read a few of the FF or Ad&D books and thus might have missed the ones that were good. The good ones, to me, involved some new twist or new take on things; the bad ones were formulaic "kill the henchmen kill the bad guy get the gold get the maiden now its over" stories. To me, what makes a good series is some real depth like Magnamund has: everything was so well planned and thought out in advance, rather than a haphazard "lets throw in a lizard man here" approach like the bad game books seem to have. There's a system that LW fits into rather than being on some random planet/world/universe like the AD&D and FF books were (even FF realized the benefits of it and tried to tie their stories together into the world of Titan, but it was too late by then). I think when you've mapped out the world, given it a time line, a system of deities, a major conflict (that takes 20 books to resolve) and several interesting subplots, etc. it makes for a good book and a good series: there's a reason why a particular monster is in your way, there are subplots that all tie together and make sense rather than seeming to be random plot developments, there are interesting recurring characters that I'm glad to see again and when I do I wonder what's been happening to them in the meantime, etc. That's what I love about LW: I think about being in Magnamund, meeting the minor characters, etc. I even spend time wondering about what's going to happen to the people and the countries and the gods, etc., something I'd never do with a "one-shot" game book or miniseries where the depth is lacking. With the FF/AD&D/etc. books, at their best I only thought of maybe having that particular adventure: there was no real world to think about or get interested in. The world - even more than the individual stories - keeps my interest going, keeps me thinking about it between books, etc.; with FF or AD&D I'd just check out any new book to see if it was something different. Dever also did a similarly great job with Southern Magnamund in Grey Star (I liked those books alot myself) and even the freeway warrior series was better than it could have been for the same reasons. On the other hand, I think the last 7 LW books have suffered because Dever's grand design has run his course: the new adventures just aren't as compelling as the old quest against the darklords was: with the death of his main story line, each book now revolves around what I sort of view as a "subplot" to the epic war with the Darklords, and the individual subplots just don't hold my interest like the war did. So maybe in addition to a well thought out world, you need a great and epic adventure to take place in it. Matthew McWhorter In reply to those who slam FF books: I grew up reading FF books, then tried other systems, finally arriving at LW books. Whilst FF books don't have an indepth world behind them, who really cares ?? When I first started reading them, all I wanted to do was kill the bad guy and have some fun doing it, never pausing to think "If I do this or that, what ramifacations will it have in 5 book's time ?" FF books were quick and deadly, with hardly any outside world to worry about. Most of them were set in the loosely interwoven world of Titan, which in itself spawned a few novels (Demonstealer, The Trooltooth Wars, etc). Other gamebooks that I can remember are : Wizards & Warriors Demosspawn The Altheus Chronicles Endless Quest I seem to remember that the first 'double' gamebook set was probably the FF 'Clas of the Princes'. (although it could well of been Ace of Aces). All in all, FF was a good series, producing maybe 75 gamebooks, a 13 edition magazine series and several offshoots (Goldmoon series, Zagor Chronicles). Although it doesn't compare to LW in depth of stories/characters, it was good in it's time (which has now passed). Shane I'v egot Middle Earth Quest #?: Treason at Helm's Deep. From what I recall, it wasn't too bad, although it lacked a fair amount of depth. My cousin had another one at some time, Mines of Moria. As for my opinion of what makes gamebooks good, I like good plot, with great supporting artwork. Original ideas are a must (not like my early gamebooks!!!) Gee, the best gamebook series are by far: Fabled Lands, Lone Wolf, Fighting Fantasy - and possibly Way of the Tiger (although I hated the ending), closely followed by Freeway Warrior, Grey Star, Virtual Reality, Blood Sword, Sagard the Barbarian and so forth. I hated the Duelmaster series and Combat Heroes (was there ever any need for two player adventures? - although I did enjoy Clash of the Princes, a FF 2 player adventure). The Skyfall series was too damn hard to rate a mention! Tristan Taylor Gday Kai members. I remember playing heaps of gamebooks when I was younger. I'm pretty bad with titles of things these days (WAY too much partying etc) but here goes. Lone Wolf was a favourite for me and my cousin. We'd both go to our local libraries and get what we could and try to find about 3 in a row so it wasn't "dumb". He played them way more than I did because I got so frustrated with them. Even if you took choices which seemed right, sometimes there wasn't even a chance to escape from death when a "sorry your mission and your life ends here" section popped up, just from choosing a certain way. That pissed me off. But I did play FF also, but thought they were really weak. Even at a pre-adolescent age I thought they were patronising, thinking that kids (mainly directed at boys) would think an adventure would be more fun if a big monster was whacked in, or piss-weak aliens or something. I mean, if you're going to do that kind of stuff, do it right like Joe Dever did. I remember laughing at one of the FF books that one of my older cousins was reading. "Island of the Lizard King" or something. But there wasn't really much around. There were some great historical ones which I remember playing and were really good. Perhaps someone can help me with titles, or series? Themes included: * WW2 Europe (Spitfire flying, then escaping from a German camp) * Highlander (Scots in about 1200's?) * US Independence (Redcoats, Bluecoats) * English Civil War (Roundheads) And everyone MUST have played a "Choose your own adventure" somewhere along the line. I always thought they were REALLY weak, written by some old lady or something for kids to have pretend adventures and never do anything out of the ordinary. Now there was death at every turn if you remember them correctly! I really got into RPG's after that, once the early years of high school were established. I didn't really see any point in starting D&D seeing as it had been around for so long, and three didn't seem to be any basis for it. I mean, and core book. I tried my hand at a little Shadowrun (FASA) before getting into the Star Wars RPG (West End Games). I got back in Shadowrun afterwards as it developed more. RPG's just had the ultimate flexibility which had ticked me off with gamebooks at the start. Luke (Moon Hawk): "Kindy" = kindergarten Tristan (Black Death): I'm from Adelaide, South Australia. :) Banedon aka Simon :) I really don't like the fact that Joe decided to incorporate Alyss into the later GM adventures. She's best suited for the Legends series. There's no real connection that says what happens after she disappears at the end of Hunting Wolf until she reappears to Lone Wolf in - I think it was Book 16, wasn't it? Unless she comes back in a future Legends book. I only have up to Hunting Wolf. She's a good character, but I don't think the gamebooks are quite the right context for her. Ig kika ok, Jason >> At first, I was horrified to learn that some kai lords on >> this mailing list >> would actually consider stealing books from a library, but >> then I had a >> thought. Lone Wolf stole lorestones from the Cathedral at Tekaro, from >> Kazan-Oud, from the Elder Magi's long lost temple in the >> Danarg and so on. >> In fact, the whole Lone Wolf series is based around theft of some >> description or another, so I really can't condemn or condone >> this issue. >> >> Black Death >> >> (aka Tristan Taylor) >Lone Wolf didn't steal the lorestones! He had a birthright to them! Gavin I realise that, but it's the principle of it that I am concerned with. After all, you might say you had a birthright to #22, as it was the book you were born to own! My main contention was that the whole series was based around theft of one type or another (I mean the lorestones were presumably stolen off the kai at one ime or another). Tristan Taylor At 06:32 PM 22/10/98 +0100, you wrote: >In my US edition of LW8, The Jungle of Horrors, it says that the >Berkley/Pacer edition, rather than the Berkley edition, was abriged. >Anyone know about this? >-- >Moon Hawk It is to my understanding that Berkeley merged with another publishing company, namely Pacer Books, during the mid-late 80's. It was probably due to this merger that the cost factor was established, and books had to be abridged. Berkeley was probably a decent publisher before the merger! [EDITOR'S INFO: In fact, Berkeley took over Pacer after #2, and shoddy US copies have been in circulation ever since]. At 01:15 PM 23/10/98 EDT, you wrote: >I don't think we've gotten a straight answer as to why LW#22 went out of >print so quickly. Did Red Fox publish less copies? Did they fail to >distribute them? Is it the stores' fault? If you think about it, as >far as we know there are about five actual verified copies of the book >in the world. One in Luke's library, and a few others on this list own >a copy. But Red Fox had to have done something to make this book go OOP >so fast. Does anyone know the answer, or can anyone offer any possible >solutions? Jason I'm pretty sure that we've established that the most appropriate reason is that huge demand / less supply. I'll go over it once again. #1 Flight from the Dark has been (re) published 3 times (4+ if you count US editions), giving everybody, new and old Lone Wolf fans alike, a very good chance of getting the book. Buccaneers, however, is a relatively new book and has subsequently been printed once. That measn that new and old fans have a slim chance of picking up this only reproduction of #22. What's that you say? Explain why #23-28 haven't sold out? We'll, I know from experience that a lot of Lone Wolf fans were a bit disenchanted with the New Order series, and have left the genre altogether. I must admit that I too was disenchanted with the New Order (esp #25 & #26) but I found that Vampirium emaninated some of the glamour that occured in the Grandmaster series. All I can say is, I can't wait for #28 to hit the shelves here down under! Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) I'm from the suburbs of Los Angeles, and will be 20 in February. jen I am 22 and live in Brisbane, Australia. Since most attempts to obtain LW books at bookstores are fruitless, why not try these hints... * You can avoid the looks if you do your investigating over the phone instead. * Don't act too enthused either when investigating or when buying - this sets up the next tip. * You can always pretend to be a parent or elder sibling of the person supposedly buying. * If you order something in or set aside over the phone, it is more believable that you are picking up something for someone else Hope that helps, Ryan I am currently residing in Australia, but am from and am going back to Texas. The quiet, Todd DeWolfe I'm from Melbourne, Victoria, Australia .....I'm also 17 Tristan Taylor My turn, I'm 28 and from Bremerton, Wa. across the Puget Sound from Seattle. Also have been a fan since '84. Kai Lord Star Seeker - Michael Norton What a surprise to wake up today, sleepily check my email and find 36 messages awaiting my attention, all from kaiwisdom. Classic. I'm 21 and first got into Lone Wolf when I was 12, all fighting for the same books at the local library! I'm from Adelaide, South Australia. Banedon aka Simon :) The name's Nick Raphael. The location is Woking, England. I'd like to try and add a new topic for discussion if I can... I'd like to hear what people think will happen in future LW books. We can have to threads of thought: What people WANT to happen and what peolpe EXPECT to happen. I know what I would want. I remember looking over the maps in the front cover and seeing little islands off the coast and wishing that the story would take me there. Or perhaps seeing a group of hills or a wood. So, for me, it's not so much the grand plot or some big monster, but visiting some remote corner of Magnamund. As for what I EXPECT will happen - I'll leave that for all you. I haven't caught up with the latest books yet. (today I got 22 - Bucs of Shadaki). It also seems to me that Magnamund is quite a small place. Maybe - In some future adventure, LW will find another continent... But no - I said I'd let you speculate. Nick Raphael nickr@sfwindows.co.uk I don't think Lone Wolf has ever journeyed to the Maakenmire Swamp. You'd figure that someone would have to infiltrate V'ka and kill Vag'kroag sooner or later... Jason Yeah that's right. We keep hearing of the horrors of Maakenmire. You'd think the almighty Sommlending conquerers would have done something about that by now! (actually, being so close to Sommerlund would have been a perfect inclusion to the first 5 books, if you follow what I mean). Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) Well, here's some stuff I'd like to see... - Assuming she's still alive, whatever happened to Kari (LW's sis)? - How about a showdown with Agarash? LW did take down a Drakkarim god, after all. And maybe Shasarak, while we're at it. - I'd still like to see Grey Star, Tanith, and the gang again. - As JD has mentioned, some stuff about Banedon (assuming there are books about his early years, I kinda hope Alyss is left out). - Third time's a charm? Bring Vashna back. - There's still lots of cool stuff in the Daziarn. - Even though Cadak's gone, the Cener Druids are probably still around. - How about some more time on some of those alien worlds? What would a world look like where Good had prevailed? Evil? (We didn't see much of Avaros). Well, that's all I can think of for now. rob As for what I WANT to happen: I wouldn't mind seeing a final apocalyptic battle between Sejanoz's dark forces who infiltrate most of Southern Magnamund, and maybe even parts of Northern Magnamund (Sound familiar?!). I'm not sure if you kill Sejanoz in #28, but he is the only character who is likely to amass such an evil invasion force. I've always liked the idea of mass battle campaigns (although I've never really gotten into Warhammer or so forth), and I've even attempted to write some mass battle gamebooks! They are too hard to master, as you've got to keep track of all of the opposing forces. I'm still interested in the idea of them anyway. I.E. I would love it if Joe put out a campaign set in the Stornlands of the War of the Lorestone. Now that would be cool! As for what I expect to happen: No doubt the Grandmaster will find a shadow gate leading to the Daziarn or beyond, and he will have to seal it, and stop the evil forces of Naar getting thorugh. I hate to say it everybody, but I believe the Shadow Gate thing has worn thin. Sure, Prisoners of Time was a great book, a novelty even, but we can only take so much. With all the vast realms of Magnamund (of which one third - one half has still not been covered in the Lone Wolf series) why do we have to keep going back to places that have been covered? This is not having a swipe at anything, so please don't take it personally. I'm just putting in my opinion. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) > >I guess one of my questions would be why is it that in Book 2, you can > >simply point the Sommerswerd at Zagarna's tent and destroy him with a > blast > >from the sun-sword but you actually have to battle it out with Haakon > and > >Gnaag? > > > In book 5 when you are fighting with Haakon you are in an underground > vault. The Sommerswerd has no sunlight with which to draw its power. A > very good defensive move by Haakon if I do say so myself. Indeed. He must have heard what happened to Zagarna, his predecessor. :) > As for Gnaag (correct me if I am wrong) but if you wait to draw the > Sommerswerd out of its Korlinium scabbard until the very end of the book > doesn't its power just destroy everything anyway? Doing away with > actually fighting anybody? Yes. It vaporizes Gnaag. But woe unto you if you draw it before fighting him. My first time through, I made the mistake of drawing it to fight Taktaal (Hey, I figure I was in the Tower of the Damned, close enough, right?) and got tossed into the Lake of Blood for my trouble. So close, but yet so far. :) Mark At 10:33 PM 18/11/98 -0500, you wrote: >I recently finished rereading the GS series and found this in book four: > >(Minor spoilers below).... >Towards the end of the first section the Shianti allow you one question >before they must break contact. If you ask them for their own advise they, >among other things, advise you not to confront Shasarak until he weakens >himself with some great dead of sorcery. >Later on in the book as you approach the Morn Pass with the Freedom Guild >army you are given the choice of teleporting to Shadaki to confront >Shasarak. If you do this you may, if you decide to challenge it, fight an >Ipage Demon (20/20). If you don't challenge it you can just walk in to >Shasarak's throne room. >If you don't decide to teleport, presumably following the Shianti's advice >to wait for Shasarak to expend some of his power you are not disappointed. >He evokes an army of the undead where you are forced to fight a Skeleton >warrior (20/25) (note that this enemy is more powerful than the one you >might face if you teleport earlier). After defeating this enemy you have to >teleport to Shadaki, whereupon you find yourself directly in Shasarak's >throne room. >My point is this: if you follow the Shianti's advice, you are forced to >fight an enemy stronger than the one you might face if you don't follow it. >And if you're smart you can even walk into the throne room without fighting >anybody. > >Any comments on the Shianti's "wisdom"? > > >Alfonso Cruz >"Conde Zog" I think the Shianti are wise enough to allow you to make your own decision. Tristan Taylor When you fight the Xargath(the sea serpent) he is just outside and swinging away. He has 100 here. But if you read the book carefully, when he has like 15-30 it's because his head is stuck in the side of the ship. It can't get free to smash you. It is a sitting duck to swing at. Most of the time Joe set up the game books to favor you if you didn't have the sommerswerd. The enemy would be (badly damadged) instead of (lightly wounded). If you look next to the names of the enemies, the condition of the enemy is sometimes stated. When you fight the Chaosmaster in either 10 or 11 if you use the sommerswerd you lightly damage the Chaosmaster. If you have the Iron(heart???) broadsword instead, you heavily damage the chaos master and go into combat with the chaos master having a lower endurane and lower combat score. The sommerswerd gives you an advantage and if you don't have it the books try to make it a little easier. Steve Guys. I just got an order the other day which I put through to Black Death (our Kai friend Tristan). Very successful. The man is pure professionalism and needs to be commended. If anyone wants LW books this is the Kai LORD you need to contact. :) Banedon aka Simon :) I would also like to give my recomendation for using Black Deatch (Tristan Taylor). Just remember he is on summer vacation (Australia) and may not be able to respond to any e-mails until late Febuary. Shadow Wolf (Vince Beers) I as well give a hearty recommendation for Tristan. My transaction with him went very well. Dead Wolf (Derek Jackson) I'd like to add that Tristan is a great example of how this trading SHOULD be done! Gavin Gallot > Would someone that has the books handy, please check what your options are > when you fight the darklords. You can't be required to have the sommersword > everytime since each book is playable completely on its own. You bet. Here are the ways to fight the various Darklords if you don't have the Sommerswerd handy: Darklord Zagarna: No other options, sorry. :) Darklord Haakon: Take his blue gem and use it against him, destroying both him and the gem. Darklord Kraagenskul: Either use the Dagger of Vashna or knock over one of his flaming pillars, disarming him, and then take Helshezag and use it. Darklord Taktaal: The Dagger of Vashna and Helshezag both work against him. But the Zejar-Dulaga is an even better option, get my point? ;) Darklord Gnaag: Again, the Dagger of Vashna and Helshezag are workable options. Good luck against his Combat Skill. Mark > Would someone that has the books handy, please check what your options are > when you fight the darklords. You can't be required to have the sommersword > everytime since each book is playable completely on its own. You bet. Here are the ways to fight the various Darklords if you don't have the Sommerswerd handy: Darklord Zagarna: No other options, sorry. :) Darklord Haakon: Take his blue gem and use it against him, destroying both him and the gem. Darklord Kraagenskul: Either use the Dagger of Vashna or knock over one of his flaming pillars, disarming him, and then take Helshezag and use it. Darklord Taktaal: The Dagger of Vashna and Helshezag both work against him. But the Zejar-Dulaga is an even better option, get my point? ;) Darklord Gnaag: Again, the Dagger of Vashna and Helshezag are workable options. Good luck against his Combat Skill. Mark > How many Doomstones were there? I would assume 7, just like the > Lorestones. Yes, there are 7 Doomstones. > Second, how many have been accounted for? > > I know of 4 at least: > One in the hands of Zakan Kimah (destroyed?), one in the caverns of > Kalte, one in Castle Death (destroyed?), and the Doomstone of Darke > (destroyed?). I would say three. Zakhan Kimah's weapon was called the Orb of Death, but I don't think it was a Doomstone. It appeared to be one of Haakon's little toys (he seemed to like glowing stones that shoot energy bolts). > The reason I put a ? next to the destroyed is that I find it dificult to > belive that items of such powerful evil would destroy them selves just > because their weilders were killed. The Doomstone in Kalte is either not found, or discarded at Loi-Kymar's request, so it's still around. The other two were destroyed. Lone Wolf cuts the one in Kazan-Oud in half with his weapon, and the Doomstone of Darke exploded along with the Nyras Scepter. I do agree with your point, though. Just because their wielders got killed wouldn't necessarily spell doom for the Doomstones. :) In fact, I find it kind of odd that Lone Wolf was able to destroyed the Doomstone at Kazan-Oud with a simple hand weapon, especially when you consider how hard it was to destroy the Lorestones (see LW #10). Perhaps the Doomstones just weren't built quite as good. You know how imitations are. :) All theory aside, I think the main reason that Lone Wolf was able to destroy two of the stones was as a plot device. Sure, killing Warlord Magnaarn is cool, but isn't it so much cooler when the Nyras Scepter explodes in a column of fire? I've always been a fan of the dramatic (and the pyrotechnic). :) > OTOH, if they were destroyed, does this mean that the Lorestones will > fade away if Lone Wolf is ever killed? No, I don't think so. Nyxator was the original creator of the Lorestones, but they stayed around even after he was slain by Agarash the Damned. Mark I'm not sure Zakhan Kimah's Doomstone was even a Doomstone. I remember in book 5 when Haakon gave it to him, calling it the Orb of Death. I'm sure the Doomstones themselves are quite potent orbs of death, but I don't recall Zakhan Kimah's little black sphere ever being actually referred to as a Doomstone. I don't think the Kalte Doomstone was destroyed. In the book, you might not even find it. But if you do, you can just leave it there, or, if you take it with you, it rots your skin away and Loi-Kymar tells you to toss it away and you have to pour some of that nifty Red Laumspur onto it. The Doomstone in Kazan-Oud was probably destroyed. If you don't have the Sommerswerd, you have to actually cleave the Doomstone in half so that you could take the Lorestone. I don't remember what happens if you do have the 'Swerd, though. The Doomstone of Darke isn't quite destroyed. More like, it doesn't exist anymore. When Lone Wolf killed Magnaarn on the highest spire of Darke, the Doomstone and the Nyras Sceptre vanished as if they never existed in the first place. This doesn't quite mean that they are totally destroyed. Remember what happened with the Deathstaff...? Jason >Perhaps the Doomstones just weren't built quite as good. They just don't make glowing crystals of power like they used to. >>OTOH, if they were destroyed, does this mean that the Lorestones will fade away if Lone Wolf is ever killed? >No, I don't think so. Nyxator was the original creator of the Lorestones, but they stayed around even after he was slain by Agarash the Damned. Maybe I'm remembering funny, but I could swear that in at least one of the Magnakai adventures, after you get a Lorestone, its power is totally infused into Lone Wolf's body and as his EP is brought back to its original level, Lone Wolf looks back down at the Lorestone only to see it as a worthless glass sphere. Is that actually in one of the books??? But I don't think that happened. Besides, Lone Wolf has the seven Lorestones in the Vault of the Sun. That's how he ages five times slower, because as he trained in their golden light, they gave him more of their power. I guess. The Lorestones shouldn't lose their power if Lone Wolf dies. But what about the Sommerswerd? Didn't King Alin or someone say that the Sommerswerd would lose its godly power if wielded by a non-Kai? And if that's the case, how did King Ulnar I have the time to train as a Kai and be able to run the country? And what rank was he? You'd think he'd have to be pretty important to get the Sommerswerd. And what about Sun Eagle? Did he have the Sommerswerd, too? That's enough for now. Thank you for playing. Jason Jason Valasek wrote: > Maybe I'm remembering funny, but I could swear that in at least one > of the Magnakai adventures, after you get a Lorestone, its power is > totally infused into Lone Wolf's body and as his EP is brought back > to its original level, Lone Wolf looks back down at the Lorestone > only to see it as a worthless glass sphere. Is that actually in one > of the books??? You're remembering right. It's in Book 6, the first time LW gets a Lorestone. I think there is something of a "charge" process. The Lorestones accumulate power with time. When LW finds one, it's fully charged and directly transmits its power into him. ( In Book 6, the immediate effect is not about restoring EP, it's about knowing how to slay a Dakomyd. ) Immediately afterwards, LW has all the wisdom, and the Lorestone is discharged, so he sees it as a worthless glass sphere. But with time, the Lorestone begins to glow with power again, ready to be touched by those who haven't yet, and diffusing a good wise-making light anyway. > The Lorestones shouldn't lose their power if Lone Wolf dies. No, they shouldn't. As far as the Sommerswerd, the Nyras Scepter, and like, are concerned, I have my opinion about them ( something about a credit of power, and the object is destroyed if you die before you have paid your power debt, the credit being significantly larger with Evil magic objects ), but it would be a bit too long to explain in detail. Laurent Bercot ( mailto:Laurent.Bercot@irisa.fr ) Yes, I remember this from book 6. It could possibly be one of Joe Dever's rare mistakes. Laurent also gave a very good possible explanation in his last e-mail. > The Lorestones shouldn't lose their power if Lone Wolf dies. But what > about the Sommerswerd? Didn't King Alin or someone say that the > Sommerswerd would lose its godly power if wielded by a non-Kai? And if > that's the case, how did King Ulnar I have the time to train as a Kai > and be able to run the country? And what rank was he? You'd think he'd > have to be pretty important to get the Sommerswerd. And what about Sun > Eagle? Did he have the Sommerswerd, too? In Fire on the Water, it does state that the Sommerswerd will lose its powers if anyone other than a Kai uses it. As for King Ulnar wielding it, I have a possible explanation. King Ulnar could not have trained as a Kai, because Sun Eagle had not yet founded the Kai Monastery. Sun Eagle was a Sommlending Baron at the time of the battle of Maakengorge (where King Ulnar used the Sommerswerd to slay Vashna). It was after this battle that he spoke with the magicians of Dessi and began his quest for the Lorestones. This is all from the Magnamund Companion, for the curious. :) My point is that Ulnar could not possibly have been trained as a Kai. My guess is that he may have had the potential to be a Kai, and thus there were no problems with him wielding the Sommerswerd. Of course he might have been able to get away with wielding it even without dormant Kai disciplines. Being king of Sommerlund *does* have its advantages, after all, and the Kai didn't exist yet. :) I don't know if Sun Eagle had the Sommerswerd or not. The gamebooks don't say, and neither does the Companion. We do know that it was bestowed upon Durenor as a symbol of trust and alliance between the two countries soon after the Battle of Maakengorge. It's possible that Sun Eagle may have borrowed it long enough to complete his quest, but the books offer no information on the matter. Mark Here's a question to anyone who has read FW lately. When Cal goes to Wellton, he is attacked by CapeCod who in the illustration by Brian Williams wears a Tshirt with Outlaws written on it. After killing Capecod, Cookie tells you that he was from the Pumas clan. Has anyone else noticed this error? Gavin Gallot >In LW7, there is a part where LW falls asleep because of some sleep-gas. By this time, if LW has gone through LW6, he is a Primate in skill. In the Nexus improvement section, it states resistance to gases, poisons etc. So why isn't there a page to turn to for "if you have nexus and have attained the level of Primate....."? > >And while we're at it, the Curing enhancement says it will slow the effects of poisons and dieases. Yet, according to the description for Curing, you can already cure dieases.......? Good questions - but think about this one.... Has anyone noticed that unless you have either Diviniation, Pathsmanship or Invisibility in book 7, you die. And there's not a thing you can do about it. Either you go through the red ruby arch and die, or you go through the green jade arch and, well...you die. The only way to find that secret little trapdoor in Zahda's Maze is to have one of your Disciplines to be Invisibility, Pathsmanship or Divination. Jason >>In LW7, there is a part where LW falls asleep because of some >sleep-gas. By this time, if LW has gone through LW6, he is a Primate in >skill. In the Nexus improvement section, it states resistance to gases, >poisons etc. So why isn't there a page to turn to for "if you have nexus >and have attained the level of Primate....."? >> >>And while we're at it, the Curing enhancement says it will slow the >effects of poisons and dieases. Yet, according to the description for >Curing, you can already cure dieases.......? > >Good questions - but think about this one.... >Has anyone noticed that unless you have either Diviniation, Pathsmanship >or Invisibility in book 7, you die. And there's not a thing you can do >about it. Either you go through the red ruby arch and die, or you go >through the green jade arch and, well...you die. The only way to find >that secret little trapdoor in Zahda's Maze is to have one of your >Disciplines to be Invisibility, Pathsmanship or Divination. If you climb on top of the dead worm, which is always an option, you'll also get out of the maze (294). It's only if you don't do this (46) that the discipline is required. Besides, I always go for the Lore-circle of the Spirit first, so I have Divination anyway in this book. :> I am trying to complete the timeline at the City of Varretta. Could someone please help. I need events after 5077 5076 - Warlord Magnaan finds the Doomstone of Darke / Magnaan uses the Doomstone to force the Nadziranim to assist him / Lone Wolf slays Magnaan 5077 - Naar creates the Deathstaff / Lone Wolf prevents Ressurection of Vashna / Lone Wolf kills Archdruid Cadak 5077 - Naar unleashes dragon hordes on New Order Kai. LARGE GAP HERE 5083 - Lord Vandyan declares war in stornlands. Lone Wolf leads New Order Kai into war. New Order kai destroy Runes that give Vandyan his power. Lone Wolf abducted by Servants of Naar. Gavin Gallot > It is to my understanding that in LW #9, The Cauldron of Fear, when Lone > Wolf plunges to his grisly death after the treacherous Senator Chil severed > the rope on the Supreme One's ride down, you need to get a random number, > and you either subtract or add a Nexus 'bonus.' Unfortunately, this bonus is > adverse, as it kills you. WHAT'S THE POINT IN THAT??????????? I thought > Nexus would save you (or at least help a bit) in that situation. Comments? > > Black Death > (aka Tristan Taylor) I just got my order of Vampirium and The Hunger of Sejanoz yesterday. I've noticed that, while there's nothing that dramatic, there are several places in both books where your skills can help improve your random number to... lose more endurance points! Either it's a clerical error or Joe has a really perverse sense of humor :) Ben Krefetz Nah its got to be a mistake. Just change the bottom and top paragraphs around, sure sometimes having an ability is bad (such as Kai Alchemy preventing you from getting the iron skull in book 21) but how would Nexus freeze you to death? after all there are other mistakes. Campbell Pentney When I first encountered this 'Sudden Death' in my German LW 9, I believed that the translator screwed something up (like he REALLY did in LW 8). But when I finally got the UK Edition, I was quite surprised to see that this error (?) was JD's fault (?). After all I believe Nexus should help you in this situation. Mad Dog (aka. Hauke Murr) I always assumed that the page numbers for the first and last entry got switched, either by the publisher or by Mr. Dever. Nexus is definitely an asset, should you ever unexpectedly plummet into a pool of water from several hundred feet up. :) Mark J. Laird I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about there. Is that where Lone Wolf lands in the water and you have to drop stuff out of your backpack and swim to the surface or else you drown? I think that's also in book 9, and, in the US version at least, there is one part where it says to add 4 to the random number if you have Nexus, but I think it's just a typo and they switched the two section numbers around; the death one goes with the low number and the surviving one goes with the high number. That's all I did. Jason Australia cost for new LW books $9.95 New Zealand cost for new LW books $14.95 (including GST) Yes, I have many gripes about books 21+ (although the first two books in the series were excellent). After 22 your character became unbeatable, while LW did not achieve this until about his twelve adventure (and even in book 13 he was hard pressed). A few things that annoy me: - Hmmm, I have 500 kai but I think I'll just send you. (same old where an army would fail...) this cliche is used to the point of obscenity. I would like to see a book where you got to adventure with one or two or kai. Book 24 was brilliant, although the cliche was made soon after the start. - The books are far to easy. They really need to be longer (400+) to challenge a kai lord of your standing. Book 28 really didn't scratch me (like the idea of the grave robbers stealing your weapon, lucky I had 2 +5 weapons spare!) - Combination locks - argh! Sometimes if you fail you die. I died 5 times in book 24! Then I got past and completed the next four adventures IN A ROW!!!! (although 25 was a close shave, I admit that much). Books 21 and 22 were a definite exeption due to the fact that you started off fresh and easy to kill. Heck even equipment selection was important (no more "a potion and as much food as I can take..."). You also had 1 adventure where your arrows could actually miss! LW had a bonus of +7 - +10 on his archery shots which is just plain ludricous. Campbell Pentney OK, the list seems a little slow, so I'll start a new thread to stimulate discussion. When did you first start reading the FF Books? How did you get hooked? For me, I started reading them over a decade ago. I had always liked the "choose your own adventure" concept, but I didn't know FF existed until a friend of mine showed me a copy of his at the library. Of course I tried to borrow it from him, but he wouldn't hear of it (it was #21 Trial of Champions, by the way). There was a 1 book/week limit, (I had already checked out some other book at the time), but I asked the librarian if I could have another one anyway. She said no. But you know who was first in line next week... :) And I haven't looked back since. Mark J. Popp As for my personal experience..... Back in 1989, I was in Grade 2, and it was customary on the last day of term for everyone to bring a game along (board games like Monopoly etc.) I noticed one of my friends was never joining in with any of the games, but instead, he was sitting alone in the corner, reading a book. I went up to him, and said "Hey, it's Games Day, why are you reading?" (I was previously not into books). He told me he was playing a game, and allowed me to partake in it. I ended up fighting a Marsh Goblin (SK:6 ST:6 I think), I won, and got 25 gold pieces as a result. The book: FF #35 Daggers of Darkness. After school that day I raced to the bookstore and bought the book, I loved it. Whilst my pocket money level was never really high, in the early years I had opportunity to borrow the books from the library. Unfortunately, gamebooks were all the craze back then, and I often had to scrap it out to gain the books. I was finally satisfied when, a couple of years ago, I added Rebel Planet to my collection to finally gain control over all 59 of the books. Tristan Taylor For me,at 1985 my First book is #1 and #2. Very fun I think. But the book I second bought is [#10 House of the hell]!!! Not only difficult But also IMPOSSIBLE!! Because,Japanese translated book is written Japanese completely. So Real password "DRUMER" into "MURDER" is not written. Japanese "MURDER" is "SATUJIN". Maybe you can not create password "SATUJIN" any way. As you know other passwords are ALL "FALSE"! ..But I love this #10 [House of the Hell] The same reason,#23 is Impossible. In Japan #33 SKY LOAD is the last number but can buy easily all books now. 1999 Feb. Sorry my poor English. Hisaya Sano hisaya@cocktail.cas.uec.ac.jp Waaaaay back when... *start the wayback machine and set it for the early to mid 80s...* one summer, I was going on vacation with the family, and was my wont, I was stocking up on books like there was no tomorrow. At the time, I had been going through my fantasy phase and caught sight of two books: Deathtrap Dungeon and Island of the Lizard King. At the time, I had very little experience with gamebooks -- did anyone? -- and was rather taken with the idea of it. Snagging both of them, I proceeded to put them away until vacation-time rolled about. If you ever want to fully explore something, try being isolated with it for a while. En route and during the quiet times of the vacation, I played those gamebooks though... learned to map and played them again... took notes and played... ignored my conventional books and just kept playing. ;-> I beat Island first, as it isn't terribly challenging, but it soon became my favorite of the two. The story fired my imagination greatly, and pretty soon I was running Fighting Fantasy adventures of my own, using the rules from the two volumes. As you can guess, I was the target market for Fighting Fantasy the first RPG. ;-> And the rest... through the various books, three swearing off of the books... a massive AFF campaign and finally, the Endtimes... is history. -Chris Angelini I started collecting FF books after I had read most of the Forgotten Realms and Dragonlance in that year. I fell in love with the books, my first book was 3.Forest of Doom and 5.City of Thieves and from there the books opened up this new world of imagination, fantasy, roleplaying and I started to make maps and a list of monsters even before I heard of ' Out of the Pit ' even existed. From there I visited the book store 3 times every week until all the bookstores stopped selling them about 6 years ago. About 2 years ago I started designing a webpage and since march ' 97 I've had a Fighting Fantasy Vault Webpage. The current address is : http://personal.nbnet.nb.ca/surfr I have to say if it wasn't for DOC and Mark J. Popps' pages I would have a page and I would be missing all this fun... Thanks Guys and let's keep this group alive ! Gilles ' Ringlord ' Belanger ....... surfr@nbnet.nb.ca >On Mon, 8 Feb 1999, Duane Bowker wrote: > >> I'd have to disagree. IMHO, Chaotic Good means that they believe to do >> good, just not always by the law. Chaotic Good, basically, is "The end >> justifies the means." IMHO, this is the best kind of good. How can one save >> the world while they're in jail? I think Lone Wolf is Chaotic Good, if you >> haven't guessed already. >> >> And NEUTRAL GOOD?!?! That's hardly even good at all! I mean, it's like good >> is _not_ the highest of prioities! Sorry, but neutral good? I think not! > >Ummm, what are you smoking? First of all, consider people like the Elder >Magi and the Shianti, who are Lawful Good. Would you say that they don't >care about good at all? Second, Lone Wolf certainly runs the monastery >under the laws of Sommerlund and is loyal to King Ulnar (is he still alive >by MS 5084? Must be pretty old). Yes, LW goes off into lawless places and >acts as he pleases, so I would agree with CG tendancies, but I'd say overall >he's NG. There is no way LW is NG *or* CG. He's LG. A Neutral Good would either follow laws or disobey them depending on whether they thought it was good or not. A Chaotic Good is a Robin Hood type. Joe Dever himself said in the interview at the Lyris Outpost that the Kai Lords in his D&D campaign were Lawful Good. > >Ben Krefetz You know what? Ulnar's getting to old. Having no immediate successor, Joe should knock him off (possibly by an assassin involving a cool chase scene!), and Lone Wolf be elected and thence inaugurated into the Throne of Sommerlund! What does everyone think of my extreme views? Tristan Taylor Traitor! There is a traitor in the Monastery! All acolytes alert! Ok, so maybe I agree too. Us two against Sommerlund! Down with Ulnar! Blake Tucker I finally picked up #28 (about time too!) last week I was a bit disappointed with the 300 paragraphs (as is most people I've encountered), but the storyline was so linear that it didn't matter that much anyway! I did like some of the innovation Joe made to the book - why didn't he make them earlier? What I'm referring to are: -> group combat (i.e. +CS for having companions - but what's the deal with only gaining 1-3 CS? Surely they're worth more than that!) -> weapon CS bonuses, not just for the kai weapons, or Grand weaponmastery (i'm talking about the Chai spear - particularly handy when the kai weapon goes missing) Well, I'll guess we'll have to wait some time for #29-#32 - If there are such a thing () -Quite an ambiguous ending I concur too. Black Death (i.e. me!! TT) >---Tidor wrote: >> >> >> I'm not sure if this has been previously suggested, but I'll go >> ahead anyway. How about a series in which you play as a Nadziranim, >> or something of that nature? It would be really interesting to see >> the Darklords' point-of-view. New disciplines (spells or whatever), >> new enemies, new quests, new everything (well, almost). At 05:20 PM 22/02/99 -0800, Ryan O'Sullivan wrote: >I feel that the Lone Wolf universe has always had a lot of life in it >(creatively speaking). Certainly, Joe had to put Lone Wolf to bed >after 20, but the new order series is not a very interesting >innovation. If Lone Wolf is to thrive again, it will need radical >ideas such as examining the side of evil. The progression of magnakai >and grand master disciplines was very interesting. Also, the magnakai >quest was great and Lone Wolf's incredible travels in the grand master >series were great. The new order series adds four semi-interesting >disciplines and seems to have no overriding storyline like the last 3 >series. If Lone Wolf were to go to computer games, choosing good or >evil would have to be an option, as would a variety of characters that >you could use. > >Ryan (Bold Strider) I must agree with Ryan here. The New Order series certainly isn't as captivating as the Magnakai or Grandmaster series - with the possible exceptions of books #21-22. Ryan has hit the nail on the head by inferring that there is no arch-enemy that is consistently portrayed as a hindrance to good in this series (whereas you had the Draklords in the Magnakai series, and Cadak (& Naar to a certain extent) in the Grandmaster series). Joe might have been getting somewhere with Autarch Sejanoz, but that has been abruptly ended (I'm sure Joe would have loved to carry the curse of Sejanoz through books 29-32). Other notable enemies that could have been carried through include the ruler of Ghol-Tabras (forgot his name), Baron Cadanzo (yes, I realise he's dead, but he could have been carried through), whats-his-name from the Stornlands (from Rune War) etc, you get my jist. There definitely is a lack of depth (esp. plot) in the New Order series, and adding the nuance of extremely linear storylines (Do you ever make a decision that will determine the overall outcome of the adventure?), it probably is just as well that it finished at #28. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) In a previous mail I claimed that Grey Stars moonstone was given to the Shianti and taken to the Plane of Light. My source of information is the Lone Wolf Fan Club (Newsletter No 7). The extract was written by Ian Page himself. Here is the general gist of it: ---The Passing of the Shianti----- When the Wytch King was defeated, the Shadakine people fled back to the Sadi Desert. Grey Star is proclaimed 'Wizard Regent' of the Old Empire. Grey Star marries Lady Tanith and found a line of a magiocracy that would rule a confederation of free states reclaimed from the Old Empire. Direct quote here - "For the Shianti themselves a higher destiny dawned. The goddess Ishir came to them on the Isle of Lorn and took them up to the Plane of Light. Their reward was to dwell as immortals by her side and in her service in peace and serenity" Grey Star saw them once before they departed and Grey Star was given the nature of true Shianti wisdom - the last of their ancient magical secrets in hundreds of dusty volumes. The moonstone is given to the Shianti and taken to the Plane of Light. Sado of the Long Knife is made general of the army. King Samu has his land returned to him. Urik the wise of the Kundi is made advisor to Grey Star. Richard Hello all. For the sake of something to post, this is my quasi-review of the "Warlock of Firetop Mountain" computer-game produced for the 48k ZXSpectrum many years ago (c.1985, I should think). Although I am heavily critical of the game, I also harbour some wistful nostalgia towards it, because it was representative of a rather quaint era. Bear in mind, though, that although I played it many times, with mounting frustration, that must last have been at least twelve years ago, so in some details I could be doing it severe injustice. If anyone can offer recollections to correct me, that would be grand. It was, essentially a maze-game, with a vanishingly minimal premise to link it with the book itself (a free copy of which accompanied the game): the player's character had to explore a multi-screen labyrinth, haunted by various rabidy homicidal spooks, in search of scattered keys that would open the Warlock's treasure-chest, once the Warlock himself had been located and defeated. The labyrinth was basically two-dimensional: it was displayed on the screen as a plan, rather as in the archaic-era Pacman (which somewhat crippled realism, because it was thus possible to see what was on the other side of doors and walls), though in contrast to Pacman the total extent of the labyrinth sprawled over many screens and the corridors were rather spacious, several character-blocks wide. Unfortunately this was dealt with in a manner not conducive to plausible gameplay. The player's character, the adventurer, was a little 8x8-pixel dude who brandished a suspiciously phallic-looking sword and who could, in a further assault upon believability, miraculously and simultaneously fire an unlimited number of arrows in an almost continuous stream (and even move while doing it!). S/He could toddle up and down and left and right on the screen, as well as *facing* in those directions (I'm not sure about this, but I think you did not automatically face in the direction in which you were moving; this added an extra dimension in that, for example, you could scurry from side to side between walls to saturate the corridor ahead with strafing arrow-fire, but it also effectively doubled the number of keys required for full control over movement). The wandering denizens of the labyrinth were, like the adventurer, 8x8-pixel sprites. This meant that when one of them suddenly appeared in the corridor ahead, you had to align yourself with it *exactly* in order to hit it with an arrow, before it hurtled into you in all its gibbering rage... and some of them moved impossibly fast, tiny tumbling splodges of malice that flickered hectically towards you. To make matters worse, the screen did not scroll! Instead, you zipped across it, only flipping into the next screen when you hit the edge; thus corridors might run uninterrupted for the width of several screens, but you could only view short, static segments at any one time, which meant that it was possible literally to bump into a monster that you simply hadn't seen coming. The monsters themselves could not, at least, see through doors, or, I think, even open them, so you could sometimes find one of them lurking pathetically on the other side of a door and, once you had readied yourself, charge through with flailing sword in a surprise attack and put the wretched sprite out of its misery in an unlikely blizzard of arrows, which was always vaguely satisfying. Despite these flaws, the gameplay had a certain gripping, nervous tension about it. The labyrinth was, for the most part, empty. You could wander and wander and wander without encountering anything, animate or inanimate. Then, suddenly, you would spot some vicious little green sprite lurching dementedly along an adjacent corridor, but, because of the tiny fraction of the total area displayed on the screen a once, you'd have no idea whether that corridor might actually link up with the one you were then on, possibly just on the next screen. At such moments I would usually halt progress and let rip with the arrows for a few seconds, just in case, so that anything stupid enough to round any corner ahead would be converted into a pin-cushion before it knew what had hit it. Also, the labyrinth was not entirely constructed of corridors: occasionally you would stumble through a door and into a vast, cavernous void, several screens wide. As you trekked across it, your little bitty dude would basically seem to be floating in a trackless black space, bereft of any frame of reference, knowing that at the centre, wherever that was, there would probably be a key, but that there might also be some unspeakable nightmare entity loping around, which without the restriction of walls might thus come suddenly rushing in from any direction. Oh yes, and if you left the game on "pause" for about a minute (which was the thing to do as soon as a hypersonic nasty appeared, so as to collect your wits and sort out which of the dear old Speccie's squidgy rubber keys you were going to have to press), little messages started flashing up on the bottom of the screen: "hello...? anybody there...? [etc.]". Needless to say, I never completed the game, so I'd love to know if anyone else can tell me how it concluded. Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk After my initial mention of the "Warlock of Firetop Mountain" computer game it was pointed out to me that there was also a boardgame ased upon that book, of which I was completely unaware. Has anybody ompiled a list of FF titles that were reincarnated in board or software form? Might be interesting. I was not aware that there was a complete list out there. Here are the software that I know of:- Forest of Doom (saw that on my sister's book club mailing when she was still in Primary School. This was still when FF was in it's infant stages, the book "Island of the Lizard King" just came out. Not sure whether it was any good. (I am pretty sure it's awful though!) Deathtrap Dungeon came out just last year from Eidos. I believe Ian Livingstone owns this software company which is famous for Tomb Raider. I find the software quite a disappointment however! I'd prefer it if the dungeon is more like those in the 2 DD books with more traps and fellow contestants that you can join or fight with. What a waste. >Graham Hart >gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk G'day there, just thought I'd point out a discrepency in two versions of House of Hell. I'm not sure about the US version 'House of Hades' but in the original UK copy (with Puffin's 'adventure gamebook' green bar on top), a picture (opposite paragraph 264 - or something like that) of a girl being sacrificed by two goat-headed demon-worshippers is present, whilst in a more recent version of the book (without the green bar), that particular picture is ommitted. As a point of interest, the picture in question is also visible in the abridged 'Warlock' version (in issue #3), as well as a number of other drawings by Tim Sell that didn't make the cut. Human sacrifice perhaps? Tristan Taylor Any theories as to why that particular illustration may have been deleted? (I don't have the book with me, though I think I have a vague recollection of the picture). Oh, was human sacrifice the reason? I thought it was because these were childrens books, and Puffin didn't want to encourage children to play with sharp knives? :) I only wondered what other people's opinions might be on this because I don't have a copy of the picture in front of me right now to offer my own view. I guess it may well have been removed because it was deemed unsuitable, perhaps because of some revision to the writers' guidelines. I assume that there must have been some such guidelines, to put limits on, for example, the degree of permissible explicit violence in the books. I recall there actually being an report on the national TV news once about gamebooks and their potential "dangers", according to the usual scare-mongers; there was some poor kid featured, whose parents claimed that he had become obsessed with the books and was now imagining goblins all over the place. It seems bizarre now, but it came in the wake, I think, of similar moral panics over Dungeons & Dragons-type role-playing. Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk Well, I finally found it. Good grief, did I ever forget how many items I'd leeched from the books! I'm going to try to tap in a page of this a day or so, j ust to break up the sheer amount of work needed. Some items have been changed slightly from how they appeared in the various books; this was generally done because of play considerations or whim. On with the show! - Magic Sword: +2 to Attack Strength when used in combat (adds 1 to Luck when found) - Invisibility Potion: +2 to Attack Strength for 4 attack rounds. Each hit has a 2 in six chance of doing an additional point of damage. - Holy Water: Increase Stamina to 2 less than initial stamina. If stamina is already at this or higher, no effect. Increase skill to 1 less than initial. If skill is already at this point or less, no effect. Drinking increases Luck by 4. - Snake Rope: Can be animated for 3 minutes as a snake (4/4). Requires a day to recharge itself for another animation. Responds to only one owner's commands, which can be preset. - Large Shield: One in six chance that wounds are reduced by one point while the shield is used in combat. - The Giver of Sleep: Can destroy the undead. Treat as a normal arrow that can affect undead creatures requiring magic to damage them. - Spell Scroll: Contains one spell writ upon it. Destroyed with use. Allows that spell to be cast with no Stamina cost (but skill roll is still required). - Blue Candle: Dispels magical darkness. - Pocket Myriad: Can be transformed into small objects of its mass or less by a Skill roll (at -2). If damaged, this becomes (-4). - Slumber Berries: If consumed by a creature of Stamina 16 or less (current Stamina), that creature falls asleep for fifteen minutes. If eaten by persons of STA 17 or greater, then a Test for Luck will avoid sleep. - Throwing Dagger: Does an automatic 2 Stamina damage as a first strike attack. One use only. - Healing Ointment: Contains 10 Stamina worth of healing, may be used in part or in full. - Charmed Amulet: Repels Ganjees or other Djinn-kin. - Fire Wine: A draught acts as a force-bolt spell. - Enchanted Breastplate: Subtract two from opponent's Attack Strength. - Essence of Hogweed: Does 12 Stamina to stone-based creatures, on a successful strike. - Potion of Magick: Allows two spells to be cast without Stamina cost. - Battlesword: Adds one to Attack Strength when used. - Swordsmanship Ring: Adds two to Attack Strength when worn in battle. - Potion of Healing: Restores all Stamina -or- heals a serious wound, like a broken bone. - Potion of Plant Control: Grants mental control of all plants within a 2 meter area, for three minutes. - Potion of Anti-Poison: Protects imbiber from poisons swallowed (or to be swallowed, for ten minutes). - Ring of Light: Magic might! (Er, no, sorry): Creates a magic light equal to a firebrand, when worn. - Boots of Leaping: Allow the wearer to leap up to 10 meters forward, or 5 straight up. - Rope of Climbing: Provides a rope that can follow the user's commands, moving like a snake. - Net of Entanglement: Net restrains target if the thrower makes a successful Test against Skill. - Armband of Strength: Adds 5 to Stamina and 2 to Skill for a single task which requires physical labour. - Glove of Missile Dexterity: Subtracts 2 from missile combat rolls while worn. - Rod of Water Finding: Locates the nearest large, fresh and unpoisoned water source within 1 km. - Headband of Concentration: While worn, the wearer gets an additional test against mental attacks which target him. - Fire Capsules: Act as a force bolt spell when thrown, except they may inflict damage against two creatures within half a meter of one another. - Nose Plugs: Flter air and prevent noxious clouds from affecting the wearer. - Scroll of Agonizing Doom: Causes target to lose 8 Stamina. - Holy Sword: When held by someone who is ostensibly aligned towards Good, this sword restores 6 Stamina points once per day, and adds 1 to Attack Strength in battle. - Amulet of Strength Against Evil: Increases Attack Strength by 2 when fighting creatures ostensibly aligned with Evil. - Willow Sap: Restores 4 Stamina when used. - Potion of Life: Increaes Initial Stamina by 2. - Tome of Misfortune: Reading this book causes the loss of 2 Luck. - Fortunate Luckstone: Holding this stone restores 1 Luck. - Dragonsbone: Adds 1 to AS normally, or 4 to AS when used against dragons. - Iron Ring: Neutralizes any magic spell cast at the wearer. - Cursed Sword: Holding this sword in battle reduces Attack Strength by 1. Reduces Luck by 1. Cannot be put down without being dispelled. - Monkey's Paw: Lose 2 Skill points. Gain 3 wishes, which can be twisted at the game master's discretion to be rather skanky. - Silver Rod: Unleashes a bolt of energy which does 10 Stamina damage, and will not miss. The bolt costs the user 1 Skill and 1 Stamina. It can be used three times. - Cursed Gauntlet: Wearing costs 1 Skill point. Must be Countered to remove. - Monkey's Claw: Drains 2 Skill points from all who pick it up, save the undead. - Air Chalice: Has a proper operation word. When spoken over the chalice, it will summon an air elemental, as described in _Out of the Pit_. The elemental may or may not be under the user's control, depending on how the chalice is enchanted. - Parchment of Curses: All who read this parchment lose 3 Luck points immediately. - Sprite Ball: This is a small glass ball containing a sprite within. If broken, the sprite is freed. - Armband of Strength: Adds 1 to Attack Strength when worn. - Ebony Staff: When used upon another within range, it saps their vitality. Roll 1d6: on a 1-2, it removes 1 Skill. On a 3-6, it removes 2 Stamina. - Waterbreathing Potion: Allows the imbiber to breathe liquid for up to one hour. - Helm of Ut-Napishtim: When worn, it destroys parasites living in the body. - Unicorn's Horn: Adds 2 to Luck. Well, not the unicorn's luck. - Sacks of Wind: If using Speed rolls for Boat races, using a bag subtracts 4 from speed rolls. - Black Pearls: If two are used in tandem, they can create a skeleton (see _Out of the Pit_ for details), under the control of the user. - Glittering Motes: Sprinkling upon a person will restore 4 Luck. - Ring of Defense: Imposes a -3 penalty upon opponent's Attack Strength. If the wearer is hit twice, the ring disintigrates. - Cursed Sword of Might: Initial Luck is reduced by 1 when first weilded, but increases Attack Strength by 1. - Ring of Poison Defense: Will eliminate poison in the wearer's body, twice. - Ice Crystal: Only found as gifts, it has the power to summon the gifting Water Elemental, once. - Swiftstinger Dagger: When thrown, it automatically hits its target and reduces his Stamina by 10, before vanishing. - Potion of Skill: Restores Skill to Initial Level. - Potion of Healing: Restores Stamina to Initial Level. - Potion of Fortune: Restores Luck to Initial level, and increases Initial Luck by 1. - Potion of Vapourous Essence: Renders the drinker's body into mist which can drift at walking speed. The drinker remains this way for five minutes. - Necklace of the Stone: When worn, it will begin to gain weight, until it becomes heavy enough to snap the wearer's neck. It can be removed if Countered before it reaches this point, which takes less than half a minute. - Potion of Stillness: Will stop inertia from working upon the drinker's body, for 3 minutes. - Djini/Suma Lamp: When rubbed, will summon either a Djinni or a Suma. Whether that creatuer is controllable is up to the enchantment on the Lamp. - Dust of Levitation: Acts as a levitation spell. - Necklace of Truth: When worn, the wearer's questions must all be answered truthfully. - Ring of Slowness: When worn, it reduces Skill by 2. - Cursed Helm: Cannot be removed without a Counter spell. When worn, removes 1 Skill point. - Blessed Helm: Adds 1 Skill point when worn. - Emperor's Shield: When used in combat, a roll of 4-6 reduces damage done by 1. - Potion of Weapon Skill: Adds 2 to Attack Strength for the duration of one combat. - Flute of Dragonsleep: When played, will put any Dragon who hears the music into a slumber for 1-6 minutes. - Luck Charm: When held, it adds 2 Luck points. - Healing Brooch: Adds 1 Stamina after every battle. - Ring of Fire: Acts as a Force Bolt spell when used; can be used from 1-6 times (roll at moment of discovery). - Ring of Ice: Freezes the air around a target, forcing that target to test against their Skill or lose 1 Stamina per minute; each minute they receive another test. If they lose all their Stamina, they are considered to have suffocated and frozen. - Ring of Invisibility: Renders the wearer invisible (but not inaudible) while the ring is worn. - Insect Bracelet: Can be used once to kill an insect creature, big or small. - Object Orb: An object has been miniaturized and placed within the orb. If the orb is broken, the object is restored to full size and utility.. - Goldflowers: When a petal is soaked in the blood of a dog, it becomes a gold piece. - Skeleton Key: Has a 5 in 6 chance of opening a regular, non-magical tumbler. - Potion of Animal Control: Places one regular animal under the drinker's will. The animal will respond to the best of its ability (both physical and instinctual) to follow spoken commands. - Potion of Insect Control: As above, but it works on swarms as a whole, and pertains to insects rather than animals. - Potion of Mind Control: Functions as above, but pertains to humans or other intelligent creatures, who may Test for Luck to avoid the result. - Cursed Shield: Lose 1 Skill point while it's being held. Cursed shields must be Countered or else they cannot be set down. - Gas Egg: When broken, the egg releases a gas which causes the lose of 3 Stamina points and forces anyone in the cloud to Test for Luck or lose conciousness for 1-3 minutes. - Potion of Misfortune: Imbibing causes the drinker to lose 3 Luck. - Golden Owl: Provides the one who holds this object with the ability to see in the dark. - Ring of the Golden Eye: Recreates any one Bond film in its entirety (er, no, wait...) While worn, the wearer will not be fooled by any illusion. - Healing Herbs: Applied, these herbs restore 1-6 Stamina. - Healing Cream: Restores 5 stamina, though the 5 need not all be used in one application. - Slowness Brooch: Reduces Skill by 1 while worn. - Enchanted Armour: Adds 1 to Attack Strength while worn. - Potion of Trap Detection: Will allow drinker to detect willfilly set traps for a duration of 1-6 minutes. - Gas Capsules: When thrown, these release a gas which causes 5 Stamina to any one within the cloud of influence. That's it for tonight! -Chris Angelini I recently obtained the non-crappy version of #14 from indigo.ca and found some more Giak.... Section 19 "Okak dan-ish! Ok der kog!" "You stand-far(?) I'm going in!" Lone Wolf in disguise and yelling at a Drakkar who won't let him in. But I don't know what dan-ish is. Literally, it's "stand-far" but I guess it could be idiomized into "back off" or something like that. Section 60 "An okak oknar?" I forget the context, so it's either "Who is your leader?" or "Who are you the leader of?" Section 72 You fight a "Liganim (with Ziranakag)". Ziranakag is this magical weapon that, in this fight, takes the shape of a morningstar. Ziranakag literally means "magic-defend", so apparently this weapon defends this Liganim from magical attacks. On a side note, "Liganim" is Giak for "the Little Ones." Section 182 "Taag!" If you don't know what this means then you haven't read Lone Wolf. Section 291 "Okak gaz!" "You're an enemy!" One more comment - you know in the MC when it says you ask a question in Giak, you're supposed to add "ta" to the end of the sentence when you say it aloud? Why don't any of the Giaks do that then? Like in the above example, "An okak oknar?", shouldn't it be "An okak oknar ta."? Is it like putting "ka" at the end of a Japanese sentence to make it a question? Or has that become obsolete in modern Giak culture? :~) Jason Valasek (Night Owl) In section 272, you're fighting a Cener Druid, and it says to redue your CS by 20. That sounds a little bit steep of a penalty. Is that just a typo that should say you reduce your CS by 2 instead of 20? By the way, I got #28 from amazon.co.uk. Total cost was just under 9 pounds. Also, I just thought it was weird that the cover of US #13 shows Lone Wolf fighting a Dholdaarg, while that part got edited out of the US edition. I also think that for the most part, the UK covers are better, except for #20. And the cover of #13! Where's Lone Wolf's face? And why does it look like he's got his arm shoved halfway up that Vazhag's butt? I'd like to apologize to the people from the US who have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm just excited to actually have the unabridged versions of half of the GM series. Jason Valasek (Night Owl) It's funny that on all of the UK Grand Master editions, Lone Wolf's face is never shown (unless you count Wolf's Bane's face as a parody of the Supreme One). Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) I was just wondering, but can anybody beat my Fighting Fantasy collection? - 53 (of 59) gamebooks - 3 (of 4) Sorcery! gamebooks - The Riddling Reaver - All 3 FF Novels - 3 (of 4) Zagor chronicles - All 5 AFF books - 1 (of 2) Clash of the Princes gamebooks - 10th Anniversary yearbook - 1 (of 4) adventures of Goldhawk - Tasks of Tantalon - Casket of Souls - 5 issues of Warlock - Warlock of Firetop Mountain boardgame Wow, 74 books, 5 mags and 1 game! What do you have? - MrAcE (Schofield) Uh... no, I can't beat that. With only a few exceptions, I never really went for the non-gamebook material, and I didn't bother with Goldhawk because, if I remember rightly, that was designed as a kind of introduction to FF (a last attempt by Puffin to drum up some interest in the concept, perhaps?), and I didn't really feel like I needed an introduction by then. Having said that... I do have all of the 59 regular FF series, all four Sorcery! books, and the three-volume Cretan Chronicles series. I wonder if anyone remembers the Cretan Chronicles... they were not actually FF, and the combat system was very different, but they were published by Puffin (this would have been around 1984, I think), used the same typeface, and sported a very similar cover-design as the FF books (with a special "Cretan Chronicles" logo replacing the standard FF logo). The Cretan Chronicles were published in that exciting, early period when, with the appearance of the multi-volume Sorcery! epic as well (and the female-oriented "Starlight" adventures), for just about the only time in their history Puffin were being radically experimental with the gamebook format, trying out a few different ideas that could not easily be accommodated within the standard parameters of the FF format. Clearly didn't catch on, though. Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk Alright here's my collection, all regular FF gamebooks (1-59) all sorcery (1-4) all FF RPG (FF RPG, Riddling Reaver, Dungeoneer, Blacksand and Allansia) All FF novels (Trolltooth wars, Demonstealer, Shadowmaster) All Zagor chronicles (1-4) All Adventures of Goldhawk (1-4) All Clash of the Princes (1-2) Both Titan and Out of the Pit (regular issue - not oversized) Issues 1 & 3 of Warlock Magazine 10th Anniversary yearbook -basically I'm lacking: -issues 2, 4-12 of Warlock Magazine Tasks of Tantalon Casket of Souls Warlock of Firetop Mountain Boardgame Tristan Taylor Warning. This post was written during work. You have been warned. After consulting with my pineal gland, I've used the augers available to me (to whit, the visions of the future brought about by three years of staying awake for the head-rushes) to bring to you... for the first time *ever* (except in Wisconsin, where it's a major religious text)... ...THE PLOT TO FF #60, _BLOODBONES_! Thank you. Thank you. You can stop applauding now. Any time now... you can *stop*, Thoth damn it! Thank you. Guards, you can lower your spears... ow. No Ramone, *watch* where you point that thing. That's going to pucker in the morning. First of all, long-time players would notice a marked difference in how the rules operated in _Bloodbones_. Little do people know that the marketing department from the recently defunct Commodore Business Machines -- Amiga Division would have been hired by Penguin to provide business guidance to the authors of Bloodbones (more on them later). It was decided that since the rules were so well-established in the minds and hearts of players everywhere, that the most intelligent move would be to scrap them all and go to an entirely new system! Thus, players would roll 2 dice and add 30 to it to figure out their Life Points; you would start not with a sword, potion of Skill|Stamina|Luck and leather armour, but with a smart-assed sword named Sting Junior; and all combat would be fought using Rock-Scissors-Paper. There would be no in-book provisions; rather, each copy of _Bloodbones_ would ship with a 12-Pack of instant ramen and the reader would be required on honour to lock him or herself in a small room until s/he had completed the gamebook, with nothing but the ramen to eat. It would be a true challenge to win the game before the hero -- and the reader -- starved! A further refinement to _Bloodbones_ would be the very experimental Standard Trial Interface Combat/Killing Prototype Intuitive Needle. This device (or STICKPIN for short) was a deceptively simple-looking shaft of metal approximately three cm long and 1 mm wide, which contained an eye on one end and a tapered point on the other. Its main purpose was to help the reader feel as though he was *there* in the midst of battle by emulating (approximately) the pain of being slashed and sliced and diced and chopped and hacked and hewed and mangled and ground and skewered and eviscerated and disembowled and... er never mind. Whenever a wound was taken, the user would insert STICKPIN into a selected portion of his anatomy, to represent the taking of the wound. STICKPIN's clever Universal Interface would then go to work, analyzing the surface tension of the skin and gauging how best to pierce it. It also has a one-in-six chance of eliciting an 'ouch' from the user's own wetware -- proving that this universal device can work with *any* human setup, so long as the proper Nerves (v 1.1 or higher) are installed. Now, a short word on the writers and artists. _Bloodbones_ would have gone down in the history of gamebooks to have none. That's right, there would be absolutely no writers or artists at all. Instead, thirty specially selected Roarcharsh ink-blots would be inserted randomly throughout the book, allowing the reader to take full control over what s/he saw! Secondly, the entire plot would be created through ingenious use of the ELIZA Virtual Psychologist program. Let's face it, everyone knew the old girl had a book or two in her. I've only just been granted permission to reprint it here, but I've been holding onto a copy of the first sample transcript generated by the head-shrinker-cum-writer, which I've kept locked under my picture of Bob Sagat for ten long years. Keep in mind that they made many revisions to the plot generation program -- like remembering to turn the printer on, and sending the tech support guys out for donuts so they could get some *real* work done -- but this is a sample of the shape of things that might have been. <> HELLO. I AM ELIZA, THE VIRTUAL PSYCHOLOGIST^H^H^H^H^HFIGHTING FANTASY GAMEBOOK AUTHOR. WHAT IS THE NAME OF THIS GAMEBOOK? >Bloodbones HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT BLOODBONES? >I don't know. You haven't written it yet. THIS IS ABOUT YOU NOT ME. >Look, please, we're on a shoestring here. My house is in hock, EuroFightingFantasyLand's a bust, and I just sold my last kid on the white-slave market to make ends meet. We need a best seller here. HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT WE NEED A BEST SELLER HERE? >God damn it how do you turn this thing off? COME, ELUCIDATE YOUR FEELINGS. >I'm ready to go jump off a bridge. HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT GO JUMP OFF A BRIDGE? >Can't you even give me a freaking intro paragraph? IT IS DARK. YOU MIGHT BE EATEN BY A GRUE. >Um... what? COULD YOU ELABORATE ON THAT? >Did you just type something about fiction? Real fiction? THIS IS ABOUT YOU NOT ME. >OH shut up. SHUT UP. <> In an unrelated story, this transcript was also found with the note 'I can't take it any more -- it's time to end it all. Barbara, I love you, and the kids, and I only regret I hadn't spent more time at work. Please feed Mr Tibbles. - Barry. PS -- WHATEVER YOU DO, DON'T TURN ON THAT MACHINE AGAIN! EVER! IT'S A DEMON, THAT'S WHAT IT IS!' Sadly, the gamebook division would slowly be plagued by suicides, ultimately leading to its dissolution by sheer attrition. The plot to _Bloodbones_? As far as we can tell, it can be summed up with one, pithy phrase: >Shut up! SHUT UP -Chris G'day all, I would have liked to have seen a cataclysmic war (i.e. War of the Wizards style) sweeping across the whole of Titan, with the onus on you to assassinate the leader of the Chaotic forces. As for where it could be set, Some stronghold in Allansia would probably have to be established (I can't see Firetop Mountain being resurrected, though). The bad guy would probably be a new one, as other bad guys have been killed off in previous adventure. One possibility is that Zagor comes back as a monstrous skeleton (can't be that much of him left from his warlock-zombie-demon incarnations). Pretty silly, but that's my two gold pieces. Tristan Taylor I on the otherhand would prefer something radically different from what most people have in mind! I think the perfect scenario would be for the main character to play a bloodthirsty demon/evil wizard type for a change and whose sole mission is to destroy the entire world of Titan. Highlights of the adventure should include killing Yaztromo, the desecration of the Temple of the Earth Mother, massacre of do-gooder Paladins and Clerics, pillage and destruction of port Blacksand, maybe even burning up the entire Darkwood Forest! Possible endings should include wiping out all forces of good, simply nuking the entire world to smithereens, being converted to the forces of good after inflicting much carnage... etc. But with no true ending that indicates a definite "winning scenario". Michael Wong Hmm, well the FF gamebook manuscript I wrote. . .and submitted only to find the series was out of business. . .actually concerned a half-demon (sorry, not a full-blooded one!) that you, the reader, would play. ..with neato demon powers and such. . . anyhow, I don't know what's to become of all that work. Marc Gascoigne told me I'd have to delete all references to the FF world if I wanted to publish it. ahoy, Jason Harris Yes, I'd have liked to have seen the series end, if it had to end, in a unforgettable blaze of apocalyptic glory, with favourite long-standing characters falling bravely before the Chaotic hordes as continents shatter in fiery ruin and slide into boiling oceans of blood. Or perhaps I'm just getting carried away. Good stories need a definable beginning, middle, and end, in my humble, traditionalist opinion. Others may disagree. At least, it is better for a story to be concluded than to peter out in a nothingy sort of anti-climax. If you think of the FF series, or the Titan-set FF series, as constituting a kind of grand multi-volume story (not with the tight linear continuity of a Sorcery! or Lone Wolf series, but still in some sense evolving over time), then, preferably, it should "end", and not just sputter to a halt like it's run out of gas. The regular series is 59 vols long, so the finale might appropriately be BIG, not merely an afterthought. Trouble is, you only have one 400-para book to work with. Better, perhaps, to wrap it all up with another Sorcery!-style epic, several volumes, each leading into the next, borrowing characters and places from many of the regular FF books. All that said, if FF60 had been titled SPUDS OF DOOM and had featured Zagor and his demonic legions reincarnated as vengeful potatoes, I'd still have bought it, if only it had been published. Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk Has anyone noticed similarities between some FF books and Joe Dever's books? Here are the ones I've noticed: Freeway Warrior (JD) and Freeway Fighter (FF) I don't know which one of these were published first but either way there's a definite similarity. Chasms of Malice (FF) and Chasm of Doom (JD) The former was the latter. :) Caverns of Kalte (JD) and Caverns of the Snow Witch (FF) It's cold, there's a magician, and there's caverns. Again I don't know which one was first. Any others? -- Moon Hawk (Luke Goaman-Dodson) there are lots of more subtle ones... here are a few: House of Hell/Hades (ludicrous... they changed ALL references to Hell in the book to Hades in the US version)/Castle Death - an old house/castle which once housed noblemen (actually, the H of H still does, but...). a demonic master. You have one ally who dies shortly after joining up with you (the man in grey/that dude who gets killed by the big hand), the undead, hordes of minion (the Master's followers/the inhabitants). Only Lone Wolf goes into it willingly. The City of Doom/Shadow on the Sand - The first half of SotS are spent entirely in teh one city, so does the CoD. Also, everyone's out to get you. Scorpion Swamp/The Jungle of Horrors - there are lots. they both involve a swamp, for one thign. Talisman of Death/The Kingdoms of Terror - not much, but Roark reminds me a LOT of Tyutchev and Cassandra. Moonrunner - parallels: Moonrunners/Drakkharim, Zombies/Giaks, Karam Gruul/Kaag (double vowels as the second and third-to last letters and they both start with K... interesting) (King Wumpus!!!) What's the city of doom? So you mean Forest of Doom? or Knights of Doom? As for Tyutchev and Cassandra - That's originally Mark Smith's creation from the Way of the Tiger Series. He carries these characters into basically every gamebook he's written, such as Talsiman of Death (FF #11) and The Coils of Hate (Virtual Reality #3). By the way, Moonrunner is apparently a rip off of the Dr Who story The Talons of Weng-Chiang. Both set in a Victorian-England scenarion. Dude in Dr Who story is named Magnus Greel (mixture of Karam Gruul and Magnus Radu). Karum Gruul has mind-altering properties, like his (almost) namesake in Dr Who. Now, how's that for plagurism! Tristan Taylor oops... city of THIEVES, not doom. thanks, Tristan... About those books with Tyutchev and Cassandra - how rare are they? I kinda liked the characters, and I want to see them again (unfortunately, my Talisman of Death was in a small fire and the upper-right corner of th ebook is burned off, and around taht (with the top section of most every page) is all blackened. about the Dr. Who stuff - weird, I always thought that Fightign Fantasy was a bit more original. Moonrunner WAS near the end of the series, though, so I guess their writers were a bit short on ideas. Were there any lawsuits over Moonrunner? ~Desert Storm (King Wumpus) Freeway Warrior was published slightly after Freeway Fighter, Chasms of Malice was published way after Chasm of Doom (but apart from the name there are little similarities in the plot) and Caverns of the Snow Witch was published about the same time as Caverns of Kalte, if not slightly later. Tristan Taylor BBC productions and Dr Who in particular generally had small budgets .....and generally didn't sue over stuff of that nature though if it had been an american t.v show you can bet there would have been a lawsuit or 3 Sean Jason Harris asked (sorry, can't quote your message, this machine won't let me, I have no idea why not) whether listmembers know about the forthcoming Lord Of The Rings movies. Well, this one does! You betcha! The walls are bespattered with my drool as my head spins gyroscopically with excitement over each new gobbet of gossip or hard info that leaks out, my wits are all in a tizzy, they are. If there's anyone else who's interested and doesn't already know, the swiftest path to enlightenment is to point your interface at http://www.aint-it-cool-news.com/search.html enter something like "lord rings" under keywords, tick the box marked "search titles only" if you want to be sure that all articles listed will definitely be on LotR, and see what happens. Aaaargh! DIGRESSION ALERT! I am veering off-topic, best get back to gamebooks before The Moderator zaps me with his Olympian thunderbolts. So... did you know that there were some Middle-Earth based gamebooks published back in the 1980s? Better still, does anybody *have* any of them and can they tell me how sophisticated the books were? I remember seeing them mentioned a couple of times on the Middle-Earth Roleplaying List, so if no-one knows aught about them, I can perhaps ask there and see what response I get, and then report back. All I really remember reading about them is that the series was rapidly cancelled after objections from the Tolkien Estate: Iron Crown Enterprises, the publishers, hold a licence to publish games, but not books, and the gamebooks were judged to be more book than game. I find it a bit curious that there were not more gamebook tie-ins of this sort. Does anyone know more on this subject? I'm aware of a few Doctor Who gamebooks: I never bought them because they were insubstantial affairs, around 60 large-print paragraphs. There were also a couple of Star Wars gamebooks, with ghastly covers, which I have as an omnibus volume, and I believe that Enid Blyton "Famous Five" and Asterix-related gamebooks also appeared. Thoughts? Opinions? Knowledge? Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk I do have all three of the Cretan Chronicles (Bloodfeud of Altheus, In the court of King Minos, and Return of the Wanderer) - and I found that they were all quite interesting 0 I don't mind classical mythology. Unfortunately, I believed the ending left a lot to be desired - Kind of like the Way of the Tiger series ending. Tristan Taylor In book 16 there is a hideously difficult riddle to solve, Im having trouble so I thought I'd copy it down and we could all discuss it. It goes like this: The question is this - while I guard my throne of power how many servants of naar guard my throne of power? "In addition to the loyal servants there are two dwellers of the abyss. When the loyal servants and the dwellers of the abyss were counted together, their total number was doubled when the lieutenants of night arrived. But when my lieutentants of night arrived the dwellers of the abyss had to leave. *Exactly half of the remaining number also had to depart for they were beholden to the dwellers. From the remaining number I picked my loyal servants to guard the throne, I chose all of them, except one who was known as a traitor. I executed the traitor before I set my loyal servants to guard my throne. Im sure I need to now howmany loyal servants there were to start with. The line with an * is very ambiguous to. So any ideas? Campbell Pentney actually, me and someone else on the list worked out that it is always the same as the number Shamath begins with. So the answer is *10*. I guess the question is really, "What number am I thinking of?" Sam aka Star Lion ** Spoilers ahead ** I've thought a lot about this since the last time it was visited on Kaiwisdom. So READ THIS even if you were around then. There are lots of problems with this puzzle (Legacy of Vashna, section 171 US; section 189 UK). It goes like this: x = # of loyal servants y = # of lieutenants > "In addition to the loyal servants there are two dwellers of the abyss. ==> x + 2 > When the loyal servants and the dwellers of the abyss were counted > together, their total number was doubled when the lieutenants of night > arrived. [ There is a problem with this passage which will lead to problems later. Since there is a distinction made between the loyal servants and the lieutenants of night, NONE of the lieutenants can be numbered among the loyal servants. ] ==> 2( x + 2 ) = y ==> x + 2 + y = x + 2 + 2x + 4 = 3x + 6 > But when my lieutentants of night arrived the dwellers of the abyss had > to leave. [ Since the dwellers have left, there are only two groups: loyal servants and lieutenants of night. ] [ z = # of bodies to be eliminated in the next steps which also equals the number of lieutenants of night + 1 as we shall see. ] ==> 3x + 6 - 2 = 3x + 4 > Exactly half of the remaining number also had to depart for they were > beholden to the dwellers. ==> ( 3x + 4 ) / 2 = 1.5x + 2 > From the remaining number I picked my loyal servants to guard the > throne. I chose all of them, except one who was known as a traitor. I > executed the traitor before I set my loyal servants to guard my throne. [ There are several ways to proceed from here. ] ********* Method 1 ********* ==> z = 1.5x + 2 + 1 [ This is true because half of 3x + 4 were eliminated plus the one traitor. However, the traitor was once one of the loyal servants so the number of lieutenants of night is z - 1. ] ==> 1.5x + 3 = 2( x + 2 ) + 1 ==> 1.5x + 3 = 2x + 5 ==> -2 = 0.5x ==> x = -4 [ This makes no sense; you can't have a negative number of servants. ] ********* Method 2 ********** ==> 1.5x + 2 - 1 = 1.5x + 1 ==> 1.5x + 1 = x - 1 [ Note: x is the number of loyal servants plus the traitor and 1.5x + 1 is the number of loyal servants at the end. ] ==> 0.5x = -2 ==> x = -4 [ This is the same answer as method 1 but it still doesn't make any sense. It arises from the fact that the dwellers weren't loyal and neither were the lieutenants. The lieutenants were said to double the number of dwellers and loyal servants. Yet when the dwellers left, half of the remaining number - 1 were loyal servants. This is a contradiction waiting to happen. Even if you number the traitor with the loyal servants... ] ==> 1.5x + 1 = x ==> 0.5x = -1 ==> x = -2 ******** Method 3 ********* [ Ignore the fact that the lieutenants of night can't be among the loyal servants. You're still left with 1.5x + 1 is the number of loyal servants. This has infinitely many solutions. Still no good. ] ******** Method 4 ********* [ If the answer is 10 (which it apparently is) using reverse logic... ] ==> 1.5x + 1 = 10 ==> 1.5x = 10 - 1 = 9 ==> x = 6 [ Therefore the number of loyal servants is BOTH 6 and 10. This is another contradiction of common sense. ] ================================================================== Whew!! Now I know why Shamath was so confident that you wouldn't get the right answer. There's no logical way to answer the riddle. Even if you knew the number of loyal servants, there are contradictions within the logic of the passage. Joe Dever must have been on Calacena when he came up with this. Jonathan Blake I was in a used bookstore in New Mexico about two weeks ago visiting my grandparents, and I picked up Gray Star #3 which I'd been looking for forever, and 4 combat heroes books. I don't have the books in front of me to specify, but in "Black Baron", I was told to go to a page that didn't exist in my copy of the book! Page 232, to be exact. It jumps directly from page 231 to 233. Is this because of abridging? The copyright notice in front says it contains the complete text of the original. Also, in "Scarlet Sorcerer" on page 126, it tells me to goto sections y48 or y63, even though the y?? sections are in the companion book, "Emerald Enchanter" Checking sections x48 and x63 yielded nothing like what it should be. y63 is in a swamp, yet the entry talks about a town.. Again, the copyright notice says it contains the full text of the original edition.. quite confusing, to me anyways. Just so I don't get flamed, I'll add something in about Lone Wolf; What is everyones favorite 'setting' of the series? Not nescessarily book, but area of Magnamund? ~Orion the combat heroes books are very fun.....but for some reason there are mistakes in them....those errors you mentioned are in my copies of the books as well..... my favorite Lone Wolf setting is The Vasgonian Empire in Book 5......gives you the whole Foreign adventure feel....also kind gave me an indiana jones type feel...kinda strange but somehow fitting Greolin There are several typos in the combat heroes books... i used to have them all marked with the fixes... but i lost the books and havent had a chance to replace them yet... If your really meticulous you can find the right pages to piece them together... or I'm suprised someone on this list hasnt sent you the corrections... Hmm favorite setting... I really enjoyed Kalte... although i guess it would be kind of boring to keep going there... since you pretty much see everthing the first time... I would like to go back through the stornlands... that was neat to see alot of different towns in book 6... Vince Beers (Shadow Wolf) Favorite setting? I guess the exotic location of the Vassagonian Empire was pretty good...and the fact that you get to travel it in 400 sections! But Kalte and the underground city beneath Tahou had its appeal, in a foreboding sort of way. Steve (aka Grey Hawk) My favorite setting? Stornlands - definately. I guess that's why i set my web sites there. Gavin Gallot Yeah, I support Gavin inasmuch that the Stornlands are the greatest setting in the world of Magnamund. All that political intrigue, corrupt nobles and petty squabblings.... much like the history of Europe. Love to see a series depicting the Wars of the Lorestone where you can pick a character from countries such as Lyris, Eldenora, Salony, Slovia etc. Each with different missions etc. Full scale battle rules would have to apply too. It would be a big task to accomplish such a publication, but I'd certainly support it. Tristan Taylor On Sat, 13 Mar 1999, R Pentney wrote: > Recently I got book 2 of the greystar series, and although it was in mint > condition it was a US version! Further more instead of 350 paragraphs there > was only 310. Plus some of the words, especially in the introduction didn't > seem right, for instance it tells you to add 10 will power for completing > the last adventure, yet in book 3 it seems to suggest you get 5 extra > willpower for each adventure. > Is this edition an abridged version? And if so have I missed much? Any Grey Star 2 I've ever seen is 310 sections. I guess Ian Page just decided to go short on it. (Though #4 is 360 sections.) And since you get to add to your willpower for every book you complete, what's the problem with adding 10 in Book 2 and 5 or 10, depending on # completed, in Book 3? Ben Krefetz Qn: WHat is the most difficult combat you have to face in all the books? 1) Absolute measure.. Highest CS = ?? , Highest Endurance = ??? And best combination I know there's a webpage with all the enemies stats (missing book 21,22,28) but anyway offhand I think the highest CS is 60.. Kekatag the avenger and Deathlord of Ixia. Highest endurance 100.. Book 12 xargath CS 32 end 100 ! It only occurs if you possess the sommersword. I guess you need a quick instant kill to surive this.. Also I think you have 100 end opponent in a new order adventure only Best/most powerful opponent - I would say Kekatag CS 60 end 58. One thing though he counts as undead so double damage if using SOmmersword. At least you don;t get a instant kill with the sword of the sun like against Gnaag (CS 50 end 70..+12 CS ). ANother tough one is the one against Wolf bane..Where you get a Combat ratio of -4 which is roughly balanced ..But you fight untill end falls below 10..so if you already had a low end to start with...?? I can really remember if there's a higher one for the new order adventures..Probably..Since you notice that even the lowly Bandits(abeit in groups of 4-6) have ridulculously high CS in the 30s and 40s..I understood the need to do this though.. 2)Relative measure i.e how early it comes ..For example, early on in book 1 and 6 and 13 you are relatively weak.. About playing the whole sieries.. As Anyone tried playing from start to finish 1-20 and maybe untill 28 using the same character? What rules did you use?How many restarts did you allow? Anyone ever won from 1-20 without cheating or restarting..(Even with almost perfect knowledge/ominscience you can still die from combat) I know this has being disccussed b4 but, how did you handle the change from Kai to Magankai and from Magankai to Grandmaster? I have problems movingh from Magnkai to grandmaster since I end up with a Lower CS base than 25...10+5 (lore circles) + 4 CS (for weaponmastery)and I still lag behind..I would add minblast +4 CS (but it doesn't always work)..So can someone give me a way for my base CS to add up to 25 or more Rick Grotzky wrote: > > I personally have never completed books 1-20 without re-starting. I think > it is mear impossible to do this even with extensive knowledge of each > book. Combats can whittle you down to an extremely low EP and a stummble > could concievable kill you. While it is possible, I think it is very > unlikely. Anyone done this? > > About transferring characters between series, I invite you all to look at > my rules section at www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arena/5437/lonewolf.html > > Go to the Brotherhood of the Crystal Star link to get there. > > Obviously you can't transfer a character from 20 to 21, as in the New > Order series, you are no longer Lone Wolf. But as far as the Grand > Weaponmastery thing in the New Order series. I believe that you have +5 > CS with your GrandMastery weapons, as well as a further +5 with your Kai > Weapon, so therefore if you posess Grand Weaponmastery with a sword and > your Kai Wapon is a sword, you get a +10 CS bonus. > > Thoughts? > > Rick I never had all 20 books to try it with... but I'm hoping to complete my collection by this summer... I am hoping to be able to spend the summer going through the series from end to end... hopefully I will be able to keep a journal of the quests and list each fight outcome and path choices... Although certain rules I think deserve to be broken... I mean why can't you keep your Silver Helm(+2cs) from book 3... or why not stabalize your backpack # instead of being 8 than 10 it should always be the same... no matter when in the series you are... but I guess I'll just have to wait and see if i can get all the books before i speculate any further... So has anyone out there done it yet? and if you did, were there any minor rules changes that you allowed ? If no one has actually made it through all 20 without restarts how far have you made it ? I think the best I ever did without a restart was 7. I died and restarted in 8... The book that took me the longest to learn though was 5... jeez i used to die in that one alot the first couple times through the series.. Vince Beers (Shadow Wolf) >Help me out ..Here's the list I made of the basic spells available to >LW..See if I missed anything > > >Kai alchemy- lighting hand, Mind Charm, Net, Counterspell, Levitation(is >this improved?) I also vaguely remember a spell that was similar to >invisible shield in Book 13 or 14.. > >Magi-Magic- Power Word, Invisible shield..Anything else?? > >Hmm..No wonder Kai alchemy seems the better of the two usually.. >except for stopping missles.Which occurs quite a lot.. > >Anyone notice that the early grandmaster books 13-16..Opponents hurt by >Magi magic and Lightning hand will have different CS and End while the >later books mostly new order will always direct you to the same stats! > > > >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > Yes, was there really much point in putting both Kai Alchemy and Magi Magic in the Grand Master series? An interesting statistic to find out would be how many situations there are in the Grand Master / New Order series where you have the option to use one, and not the other. Tristan Taylor >>LW..See if I missed anything Funny, I reread the books and found that Kai alchemy has a spell called shield as opposed to Magi-magic "invisble shield"..But the Kai alchemy's version of shield is seldom used only in Book 13 and 20.. >Yes, was there really much point in putting both Kai Alchemy and >Magi Magic in the Grand Master series? An interesting statistic to >find out would be how many situations there are in the Grand Master > New Order series where you have the option to use one, and not the >other. They have quite different uses at higher levels..But the basic unimproved versions are fairly similar.used for long range damage b4 combat..But I would prefer if "Invisible Fist" casue more damage than "lightning hand" . If I would guess though the basic unimproved Kai alachemy is better more often used than Magi magic..Spells such as Mind Charm,leviation are spells which Magi magic has no counterpart.. Aaron Tay > >Hello Kai Lords, > >Personally, I took Kai-Alchemy at the very start of the Grand Master >(not New Order) and left Magi-magic as the last discipline. In most >cases you could use either magic, but I found Kai-Alchemy more useful >in the earlier books. So would I...Most of the improved Magi-magic are not so useful.. anyway Exception Dawn of the Dragons- Where the pentrate? spell allows you to kill the dragon with 1 shot ,saving you a combat with 50 CS monster On the otherhand Kai-Alchemy has useful improved spells like Strenght,teleport, ..Strength saved my skin lots of times..See illusion is useful for Book 19.. >PS: I think the 4th series could have been based on Banedon (that >would allow a really interesting set of magical disciplines). I really love this idea. I think we have gone as far as we can with the Kai order..IMHo new order Kai was a bad idea.. About this Banedon series, we could start it from the same time as LW..when he was a lowly journeyman sent to inform the Kai about the beytral ..It would be fun to see things from Bandeon's point of view...Eg Books could be writen from his point of view for Book 5,Book 14 (captives of Kaag)?? I see 2 problems though 1)Plotline..Banedon strikes me as ,at least not doing much after the GM series (in fact I suspect he doesn't do much after becoming Guildmaster..I don;t think we should extend the series beyond around the time of Book 12.. on the plus side, We could include Alyss and material from legends right from the start. BTW anyone wondered why LW was not aware of Alyss untill Book 16 or 17? I hoped that the later versions of Legends would explain that. Of course currently the differences might be too great to explain away.. So " legends" would be very boring if we followed the gamebooks exactly right? 2)Gaming system- Should we really adopt the LW/GS system which will result in Magical powers similar to the GS system? Maybe we should experiment with slightly more complicated systems to attract a more mature audience? After all, the LW fans of yesterday are all growth up...I would say most of us got hooked around 12 or so...and now most of us are at least 20.. Aaron Tay >It might be a good idea, I must confess that I was always eager to know >how Banedon get the Skyrider. But here's another idea: There isn't any >stories about the events occured in Magnamund when LW was in Daziarn (8 >years period), what about some Banedon's adventures during this period: >with the disappearance of LW, the good guys need some support??? >What is your opinion about that? I think it's one of the Legends books between #6 and #9 where Banedon explains that he got the skyrider and its crew through a gambling game. I'm sorry I'm a bit shady on the details - I haven't read the legends series for some time. I do agree that the Darklord blitzkrieg that occurred in the 8-year period where Lone Wolf was in the Daziarn needs to be covered, and by telling it through Banedon would be an ideal way. After all, before Lone Wolf goes through the Shadow Gate, Banedon is only a Mage Master. When Lone Wolf emerges after his 8 year absence, Banedon has risen to become Guild Master. This needs to be detailed too. Tristan Taylor I think in LW5, while you're on the Skyrider, the dwarves explain that Banedon got it in a gambling game. I'm not saying the legends don't as well, but it appeared in the gamebook first... Ben Krefetz Hi Magnamundians, Well, I've been so busy at school that I haven't had time to write (type?!) any e-mails to kaiwisdom for a while, though I have been following along. Here're the origins of how Banedon acquired "Skyrider:" "The 'Skyrider' itself was given to Banedon by the Magicians of Dessi, in return for his help in defeating the Gagadoth - a monstrous creature that terrorized their land, and over which their own sorcery could not prevail." -- "Shadow on the Sand" section 291 - Lone Wolf 5 So, what did the Gagadoth look like? One of Agarash's critters no doubt! Hmmm... I see a whole story developing here... James Humphrey aka Rune Strider aka Sir Pip of Avalon aka Paji Pathseeker of Star Wars roleplaying aka White Knight Er, who am I really? Right, Banedon got the Skyrider from the magicians of Dessi....he actually won the CREW in a gambling game....if you re-read shadows on the sand it tells that the Bor Dwarves were once crewman of a more standard vessel Greolin Yeah, when I listen to music whilst reading Lone Wolf I mainly listen to Cradle of Filth, Satyricon and Opeth (which are catagorised as Scandinavian Melodic - or commonly referred to as GOTHIC). Although the Pantera songs 10's, and Floods always seem to remind me of Lone Wolf's epic journey through the Stornlands in Book #6. Black Death (aka Tristan Taylor) Another find yesterday- I picked up a first edition of Warlock of Firetop Mountain, and noticed that the artwork continues down the spine, and onto the reverse of the book. I don't have any other FF gamebooks like this- the back is always a plain colour. Are there are other titles like this? Nathan Page You must have the original Warlock of Firetop Mountain, with the blue background, cover and spine. In the next printing, this became a dull grey. Books 1-7 were also published like this before Puffin published them with their green strip, which was later removed. I have some of these 'originals' in stock at the moment if anyone is interested. Tristan Taylor I'm a bit confused by this. Are you saying that books 1-7 were published with artwork on the back, or just that 1-7 were published first without the green stripe and green back covers? I have the "coloured" versions of 1-7, but these are merely plain on the spien and reverse (red for #2, brown for #3, blue for #4 etc). Nathan Page Nope. As I said before, only #1 was printed like that. #1-7 were printed in their respective colours. Then printed with the Green Stripe. Then with the Dragon. Tristan Taylor On Wed, 17 Mar 1999, Jason Valasek wrote: > Can anyone find a use for the Jewelled Mace? All I know is that it helps you > fight the Dhorgaan later on in book 5, which you don't even do if you've > got the good old Sommerswerd with you. Jason Valasek (Night Owl) I know that in the fourteenth book, 'The Captives of Kaag', you can use the Jewelled Mace to defeat a undead who looks same as Banedon. Coq Chantant I was pursuing a few fruitless searches through the cavernous halls of amazon.com recently when I stumbled upon the following unexpected discovery. The prematurely terminated Gamebook series published in the U.K. in 1995/6 under the series title _Fabled Lands_, authored by the ceaselessly inventive Dave Morris and Jamie Thomson, appears to have been published in the U.S. in 1997 under the series title _Quest_. Or, at least, the first two books were published in the U.S.: _The War-Torn Kingdom_ and _Cities Of Gold And Glory_. Since I was mildly devastated when publication of these Gamebooks ceased after six of the promised twelve titles (when they had the potential to evolve into the most epic of all Gamebook series), I wonder urgently whether anybody on this list knows whether the *complete* series of twelve books was published (or looks as though it might yet be published) in the U.S.. Given the appearance of only two of the books on amazon.com, I suspect not, but wandering as I now am through the bleakness of a post-Gamebook wasteland, I will lurch ravenously towards anything that looks vaguely like a new Gamebook, especially if there is even the faintest chance that the _Fabled Lands_/_Quest_ series might actually be completed. So, any news? Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk It is unfortunate that I must inform you all that the Fabled Lands series - which had the potential to be the best gamebook series of all time - finished publication after book 6. I have sent many letters to the publisher, Pan Macmillan, but have not yet heard any reply. Tristan Taylor I sent a letter of inquiry over two years ago, and received back a piece of card bearing a bit of scribble that informed me something to the effect that they (Pan MacMillan) had no plans at that time to publish any further titles in the _Fabled Lands_ series... which I took to mean that the project was dead, because they had obviously ditched it and publishers are not, I believe, inclined to take up a series again once they have decided it will not sell (which I assume must have been the reason for cancelling it in this case). Hence my surprise at discovering that, following all of this, somebody had started publishing the books in the U.S., and hence my faint hope that the entire series might have been published by that route. Never mind. Graham Hart gh115@hermes.cam.ac.uk It appears that I spoke too soon. Lo and behold, last night when I arrived home, there was a letter from Pan Macmillan publishers. It confirmed that books 7-12 will not be printed by the publisher, and books 1-6 will not be republished. Well, that should clear things up. I believe that the rights have been returned to the authors, and until they find a publisher that is willing to print the books, we will not be able to complete the Fabled Lands series. Tristan Taylor Got a quiz question for you guys.... FF #16 (Seas of Blood) contains many elements that parallel a famous historical piece of literature......... What is it? Can you name what Seas of Blood and this work had in common? (I can think of three, but there can be more...) -Jeff Poteralski My guess is the old Sinbad the Sailor story. Does that come from 1001 Arabian nights? I'm not sure, but the elements are there: Fighting the Roc, the Cyclops and the Giant Crab. I guess you can also draw a parallel to the Odyssey, as you travel to an island where the witch turns your crew into animals, which is similar to what happened to Odysseus. Most people have probably noticed that the Place names involved in Saes of Blood - Kish, Tak, Lagash etc, all come from ancient Sumerian sities. Tristan Taylor >I just wanted to wish everyone a HAPPY (belated) FEHMARN. > >Or should that be a Merry Fehmarn... > Jon Blake -except for here down under, where it's autumn (fall). What's the kai equivalent for that? Tristan Taylor I hadn't thought of that... Merry Maesmarn!! (I believe that's what it's called) Jonathan Blake